POPE JOHN PAUL II DIES AT 84

[Jeb]

61 Apr-3 From: thinkso13 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

The pope is dead! Amen! Maybe the next one will be just a little bit interested in ridding his church of child molesting clergy. The dead one did nothing but condone such crimes by enabling the molestors to remain in the church and engaging in perhaps the biggest cover up of all time. I do not understand how anyone can call themself christian and remain a member of of the Catholic Church Of Child Abuse.

 

62 Apr-3 From: codifex To: brooklynbud69

 

brooklynbud69 said:

"I pray that the new Pontiff will be more tolerant and take us forward, NOT back. The Catholic Church needs to move into the 21st Century. The challenges that lie ahead are many, but a progressive Pope can guide the Church with compassion and tolerance."

 

Tolerant. Of what? Forward and not back to what? How is right defined differently in the 21st century than it would be in any other? What challenges lie ahead? Progressive? What kind of progress are you talking about? What kind of compassion or tolerance?

 

I am not Roman Catholic. But, I have very simple views on what catholics might call dogma.

 

Right and wrong defined:

Right is that which is not wrong. Wrong is that which is hurtful to one's self or others.

 

What does God want?

To be wanted. He is jealous and will not tolerate any images to be worshiped or "venerated" instead of him.

 

Salvation. What is it?

To be allowed to be in the presence of god or at least in the light near him and be able to hear his voice (our food).

 

How do you get salvation?

It is not earned but given. The price has already been paid. All you must do is accept it and want it. Count yourself blessed if god sheds some grace on you. No other experience in this world is quite like it.

 

Can works save you?

No. But, if you have the grace upon you it is natural to work for god.

 

Do you believe in the Bible?

No. I believe in god and I accept his gift of sacrifice - Jesus Christ. The bible is but a collection of the words of god and are but a morsel of the food to come directly from the mouth of god.

 

Gay and Lesbian issues.

The human body was designed for male to be with female. Yet, it is not for us to judge but god judges. Respect and love all people and in all things let god's compassion and grace shine from you.

 

Abortion.

Is an egg a human being? No only a potential human being. Is a sperm a human being? Once again only half. But, when they are united, they comprise a new human being albeit not completely formed yet. God is not willing that any should die or be lost.

So, what is the answer?

In ages past, people used to "pass their children throught the fire". They claimed that they were sending their children to god or Baal. In reality, they were throwing away their unwanted children like so much trash. Children are not trash. There are plenty of people the world over who would love to adopt a child. Give them the chance.

If you plant corn you get corn. If you plant wheat you get wheat. If you plant beans you get beans. If you plant children you get children - it's not rocket science. If you don't want children don't plant them.

Proof from a scientific point of view:

Is the fertilized egg a complete human DNA? Yes.

Is the fertilized egg alive? Yes. It is a living cell or collection of cells.

Is a fetus a human being? Yes. Albeit a small version still growing but with fingerprints, brain, beating heart, hair.

What is the difference between a fetus and a baby. I suppose a fetus is an unborn baby.

Does being unborn make it not human? No. Human it is but it is dependant upon the parent.

Why did the bible consider a baby not a baby until the child was a few days old? Because in those days, if a child didn't live the required few days the parents were to be spared much of the heartache of loss by not giving the baby a name. Things that have names are remembered more than things that do not have names. Also, infant mortality was high before modern medicine.

 

These are my views of reality. Call it dogma if you want. It doesn't all agree with the Vatican I or II or Trent. However, I'm just glad I don't have to stand before god knowing that I condoned something that hurt another human being in such a way as abortion. I don't need that on my conscience and I surely don't want to answer for it.

 

As for Pope John Paul II. He was a pope. Responsible for leading an organisation that spans the globe. He may not have been perfect - who is. I do think that he was a force for peace and a stabilizing one at that. He was a bridge builder. I should hope to be so beneficial to the people of this world. God rest his soul and may he have a good seat on the grass where he can hear the words directly from the mouth of god.

 

Final word: If you want god... god wants you. But, if you don't want god then god will reluctantly give you your wish.

Codifex Maximus

 

63 Apr-3 From: sumatoronto To: fightgal2005

 

will somone please tell the bible thumpers to shut up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

64 Apr-3 From: gomicrosoft To: thatshot427

 

 

 

One of the greatest humanitarians of the century.POPE JOHN PAUL will be remembered by 100s of millions for his true love for all of humanity.In truth, JOHN PAUL will always live and be loved in the very heart of this world .He was respected by all,even the none belivers were awed by his presence.I as do many believe that the almighty GOD will welcome JOHN PAUL as sure as there is a heaven.

 

65 Apr-3 From: arwenmuc To: ALL

 

 

 

I just wanted to tell everyone about a wonderful story I heard about the John Paul II...

 

At Indy Christmas Conference for Campus Crusade For Christ, my friend Drew's dad took us out to dinner at this Italian restaurant...we ate in the room that was decorated with the religious stuff...and there was a representation of the pope's head in the middle of the table. That reminded Drew's dad of something....

 

Drew's dad, who works on staff with Campus Crusade has known a lot of different staff members in the organization.

 

On guy that he knew, whose family was originally from Poland really felt as if God were telling him to go to Poland and spread the gospel...to Poland...so he went.

 

While he was there, he got the attention of one of the Cardinals of Poland. He was sharing with him about what Campus Crusade does, about personal relationships with Jesus Christ....and the Cardinal got really excited. He opened Poland up to Campus Crusade, and really valued a personal relationship with Jesus Christ....

 

and that Cardinal became Pope John Paul II

 

66 Apr-3 From: life4teri To: wareswind

 

To: wareswind

"As Christ was a "liberal", i'd say you have a problem."

 

Christ was not a "liberal"...he did not and does not condone many of today's liberal views and neither shall or will the Catholic Church or next Pope. Christ was accepting of others and is forgiving of those who follow his teachings and accept him as their savior. The Bible teaches against any form of murder and homosexuality., among other current "liberal" views. I don't know what your definition of a liberal is, but if it includes any of those items or anything against what Christ taught, then I would not say Christ was a liberal.

 

67 Apr-3 From: cathee002 To: jimhobbins

 

I have a different slant on this man's death. He was simply a man....not a God. Of course, in out culture, we tend to select persons that we give extraordinary credit for words and titles. The world will mourn, and ignorant people will kneel, and pray, and light their frickin's candles for this man. My thought is that for too long, he controlled and held the attention of the ignorant Catholic membership.

 

68 Apr-3 From: ceolsabhail To: Dayhawk Kim

 

 

 

Coming from an atheist, thats right I'm an ATHEIST I will be mounful that a man who led billions of people, and has been though hell has died. From one who has no belief in God I will say that the days before his death has shown humanity at its finest.

 

ps - Like I said, I'm an atheist, but most atheists are being annoying by saying he is just another human. Face it, to billions of people he is more than a human. Imagine your mother, or anyone you look up to, dying than you will know how Catholics are feeling. Because its a sad day in catholism.

So stop preaching, Atheists. for just one minute.

 

So Pope John Paul II, IF there is a God you are with him right now. If there isn't RIP.

 

Cheers.

 

69 Apr-3 From: morashbob To: Anne

 

 

 

Anne,

 

You ask how I dare not recommend condum use? ... Easy ... The country in Africa that has had the greatest success in reducing the number of AIDS victims is the country that has emphasized manogamy and not condoms. All other countries that have emphasized condom use have seen an increase in AIDS. ... I also base it on years of medical experience. I've seen too many "condom" users contract HIV. I came to the conclusion long ago that condoms were not the answer.

 

The God I refer to, and the God I follow is the God who speaks to us through Scripture. Take a look at Scripturual teaching. The God I follow is a God of love and compassion. His name is Christ Jesus. He knows what is best for us. But, if you believe in a different god, then I guess you can follow the teachings of your god.

 

I do not want to deny anyone the partnership they desire, but having practiced medicine for many years now, I have seen the devestating impact of homosexual relationships. Yes, I have seen some who have had happy results. But for the most part the outcome has been anything but a happy one. I will admit, this is a subjective perspective of mine, but it is what I have seen.

 

Even if you do not believe in the God of Christianity, I would recommend you take the time to read Pope John Paul II's "Theology of the Body." It is an eye opener, especially if you want to see how "men" can gain a true respect for the wonderful dignity and beauty of women. Every man I have spoken to who has read it has stated it has lead them to a renewed respect and love for their wives.

 

 

70 Apr-3 From: morashbob To: jonsmizzle11

 

 

 

jonsmizzle11,

 

Yes, read your Bible. In it, if you read it, you will see that Jesus Himself gave "men" the authority to forgive or retain sins (John 20:23). Have you ever wondered why Jesus gave this authority to men? Did Jesus think that only those at that time would need this gift delegated to His followers? If Jesus thought people would need that gift in ancient times, don't you think we also would need it? Have you ever wondered why the Bible tells us that the prayer of presbyters forgives sin (James 5:16)? Have you ever wondered why Jesus told men that whatever they bound or loosed on earth, so it is in heaven (Mt 18:18)?

 

So, as you stand there judging that Pope John Paul II, try to recall, "Judge not unless you be judged."

 

Please read the Bible a little more closely before pontificating.

 

71 Apr-3 From: morashbob To: arwenmuc

 

 

 

arwenmuc,

 

Wonderful story. Thanks. It definately sounds like what Pope John Paul II would say to sharing Christ with others.

 

72 Apr-3 From: stevepfaff111 To: brooklynbud69

 

 

 

I pray that the new Pontiff will be more tolerant and take us forward, NOT back. The Catholic Church needs to move into the 21st Century. The challenges that lie ahead are many, but a progressive Pope can guide the Church with compassion and tolerance.

 

I read your post, and, as a catholic, feel compelled to respond. No one ever said that adhering to the teachings of the bible was going to be easy. We are all children of God, but there is a big difference between believing in God, and being a good follwer. Pope John Paul was a moral compass for Catholics. In the eyes of the Catholic church, ALL human life is sacred. In the bible, sodomy is condemned, as are the seven deadly sins. Just because in todays' world, these temptations are more prevalent than ever, does not mean that the Catholic church must tolerate it. I agree with you, that the church has some antiquated beliefs, there is no doubt about that, but people need to stop acting on their own whims. I am not a bible thumper, but I get so tired of fellow catholics living a life of hypocrisy. IT IS NOT EASY TO BE A GOOD CATHOLIC. I don't claim to be a perfect catholic, but I do adhere to the teachings of the bible and church as much as I humanly can. I had considered leaving the church for reasons of perceived intollerance, but the older I get, & the more I read the bible, I realize that it's pretty cut and dry. All men are in God's grace, but how long you spend in purgatory is up to you.

 

If you want to talk about compassion, I'm sure you know that Pope John Paul II had many visits with the man that tried to kill him. He did not act quickly enough on the pedophilia issues that seem to be plaguing our church, but he did condemn it publicly to the archbishops. If you want to find the truly guilty parties on this, look no further than your local bishop. For this reason, I will never again tithe to the council of bishops. The acts, or lack thereof, perpetrated by them, in my eyes are unforgiveable. I pray for the repose of the soul of John Paul II, he was a great man

 

73 Apr-3 From: cathee002 To: thatshot427

 

This man did not impact my life....he made an appearance at the window of the Vatican every now and then and had ignorant people all over the world reacting to his presence.. Our world is so full of the ignorant.......next, they will be worshipping and kneeling before someone else, and Pope Paul will simply be as memory.

 

74 Apr-3 From: stevepfaff111 To: blushn80

 

AMEN, succinct and to the point

 

75 Apr-3 From: ceolsabhail To: cathee002

 

yes they will be worshiping someone else, this pope was one of 200 or so popes, but THE TIME IS NOW, and let the catholics worship the next pope when they are ready,

 

76 Apr-3 From: morashbob To: ALL

 

 

One of Pope John Paul II's greatest contributions: Read his writings on the "Theology of the Body." You will come away with a renewed veiw of the beauty of human sexuality and what sexuality is meant for. ... In a time when people are increasingly confused about sexuality, this man, who was never married, came along and offered a gift to those willing to take the time to accept it.

 

77 Apr-3 From: markbuor2 To: jimhobbins

 

 

 

Pope John-Paul II was an old right wing bastard who set progress back many years. The only reason that people like him is because he had a fun personality. But his ideas were backward and despicable. History will see him as blight on humanity. Unfortunately he was the one who appointed most of the present cardinals, and unfortunately those cardinals will probably chose a pope as bad, if not worse then PJII.

 

 

 

78 Apr-3 From: bluesboy16 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

I think the roman catholic church is a sham.

 

79 Apr-3 From: yor442004 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

 

 

The late vicar of Rome will be best remembered for his humility, for his intimate desire to reach out to all peoples of the world regardless of denomination, sect, creed, government, culture, ideology, race, sex, etc... His humility was so great that he bowed down to ask forgiveness for the Catholic Churches' mistakes and failures from the past, so unthinkable to do before he became Pope and yet so easy for him, so human yet divine, clearly an outstanding mark of his character, an act that made ordinary men equal with him and yet made him superiorly above the level of ordinary men.

 

We are sad for his demise but also happy that God has finally taken one of His exceptional sons for a mission he over-accomplished!

 

80 Apr-3 From: dabub242 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

I believe this pope tried harder than most to get the church into the 21st century but we should not let our momentary sadness mask over some very serious flaws. John Paul's reaction to the abuse crisis for the church was typical old school stonewall. He had a brilliant chance to finally set the church right and he did nothing. His appointment of Law to basilica was a grave error and so wrong for the thousands of abused. That is just the most apparent action that should be addressed.

When talking of peace, what peace in 27 years has he really affected? None. Did he do all he could do in Ireland? His token trips around the world were like hope missions of the powerless, feeding reality absolutly nothing.

You can not pretend he entered the political arena on a world scale and affected anything. You just need to look at Brazil, 90% catholic and what a shambles that country is, the lawlessness driven by third world poverty. How can the church continue to spend in the billions and let their so called flock stand in poverty?

The longer we treat the papal office as a traveling side show, a sacred cow wandering the streets of our cities, the longer it will remain just that. When we needed a Pope to step forward with the power of Christ's word and direct the church, he passed it over, and buried it like the rest of them. Then stepped to the window and waved to the throngs who deserve better!

 

81 Apr-3 From: lpnayve To: Dayhawk Kim

 

 

 

Pope John Paul II is a model for all of us. He brought people closer to God. In a way, he was able to unite the people. He was able to touched the lives of many people not only Catholic but other religions as well. For me, he served God well by serving the people well...I will miss him very much...I just saw him on TV but his mere presence and sincere smile touched my life because I felt God's love through him...

 

I hope and pray that his successor will do the same or even surpass what Pope John Paul II has done for all of us.

 

 

82 Apr-3 From: osbr4242 To: thatshot427

 

He was a very very nice person . He help alot of people and God bless all of you in Jesus name . The Pope loved all of us ..........

 

83 Apr-3 From: Anne To: morashbob

 

 

 

Obviously, you have it all locked up and will continue to select data that suits your arguements.

 

Regardless of the lack of objective criteria.

 

No point in continuing this discussion.

 

84 Apr-3 From: Anne To: stevepfaff111

 

 

 

You don't hold the Pope, who never hesitated to criticize those he disagreed with, responsible for the atrocious behavior of his bishops? Do you know how much he coddled the infamous Cardinal Law?

 

He turned his back on the priests in Nicaragua who were trying to save the lives of those being murdered and made destitute. He advised the priests to work in concert with the corrupt and cruel government..I saw Frontline only last night which documents his failure to protect the poor in Nicaragua. He was good for the Polish, but he didn't help the former.

 

He was at heart a conservative. That's all.

 

85 Apr-3 From: Anne To: morashbob

 

Give me a break. Plenty of people have written eloquently about the meaning of sexuality, the beauty. He ain't the first by a long shot.

 

86 Apr-3 From: Anne To: dabub242

 

 

 

Finally someone here is telling it like it is/was.

 

You should see last night's "Frontline" re: the Pope.

 

He truly abandoned the desperately poor and the murdered human rights fighters in Nicaragua. Archbishop Romero had a meeting with him and left the Vatican in tears for having been treated with breathtaking,ignorant, ill informed rejection of his request for help (liberation theology).

 

87 Apr-3 From: hothingz4one To: jimhobbins

 

I think bush should be the new pope,

 

 

88 Apr-3 From: duyonfiyah To: Dayhawk Kim

 

his greatest accomplishment is when he visited hit would-be assassin and forgave for shooting him.

 

89 Apr-3 From: deadder5 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

Rock On Mr. Pope!

 

90 Apr-3 From: sh0pah0lic94 To: jimhobbins

 

 

 

I AM A BABTIST AND DON'T HAVE ANY TIES TO THE CATHOLIC CHURCH MYSELF, BUT I THINK HE WAS A GOOD AND FAITHFUL FOLLOWER OF CHRIST, I JUST CAN'T HELP BUT THINK OF MOTHER TERESA ALSO TODAY, LIKE THE POPE SHE DEDICATED HER WHOLE LIFE TO THE CHURCH AND THE PEOPLE, SHE DIDN'T SEEM TO GET MUCH MEDIA RECOGNITION , I BECAUSE OF THE DEATH OF PRINCESS DIANA. I DO BELIEVE THEY ARE BOTH IN HEAVEN TODAY WITH JESUS AND ARE IN PEACE. WE WILL MISS THEM BOTH

 

91 Apr-3 From: dman2391 To: Anne

 

To all those people who have used this forum to voice their irrelevant views regarding a religion they clearly don't understand. Get out. Leave this forum. I'm serious. You are blatently offending countless true believing Catholics. We are blind? We follow an archaic worldview? We hate and condemn a remarkable selection of minority groups? Fine, think what you like, God judges us all in the end, regardless of what you say. Read the title of this forum again. It's for memories and PRAYERS for the Pope. He was a bloody good man. He followed and enforced biblical law as best he could. A Law laid down by God, so it's not really to be entered into. If you don't believe it, then you're not Catholic. And that's fine, find or invent a religion of your own choosing. True Catholics believe in the Bible, and the teachings of the Pope, as a voice of God. John Paul was a clear and resounding voice, that helped many and, for we often forget, as a single man, performed powerful, heartwarming things that no other could do. Hell people complain about a president loosing sight of the picture after only a year or two, yet the Pope never did. If you hate him for his beliefs on sexuality, abortion etc, you're not a Catholic, because Catholics believe in the Bible, the word of God, and the Pope. If you're not a Catholic, this doesn't concern you. It's not a political forum. Please go somewhere else, and leave us our place to remember a man who brought to us so much happiness, and so much closer to God. John Paul II, no one is more deserving to be in God's presence, than you. Anus Dei, prequoles stecata mundi, misereare nobis.

 

92 Apr-3 From: solm8ts7 To: thatshot427

 

 

 

Thank You Dear Lord, for giving us such a wonderful man like our belovered Pope. I pray that all of us will take a part of him and try to live it to our fullist. He is going to make our world a better place to live. I pray with our Holy Father, that we will except people for what they are, and forget the color, or Religion that they our. Our Lord made( NOTHING BAD.) Thank you Pope John II for all you have done for this world. My the Lord hold all of us in the palm of his hands. May you rest in peace and watch over us.

James R Monaco

Tucson, AZ

 

 

93 Apr-3 From: Anne To: dman2391

 

 

 

As someone who was raised in the Church and educated in the Church for many years, I feel that it is necessary to protest the Polyanna-ish view of this Pope, as he had much influence and had the ability to do both harm and good.

 

Where do you suggest we post our protests? Somewhere where no one will notice? Oh, sure.

 

I never used the word "hate" re: the Pope. That's your word.

 

94 Apr-3 From: Anne To: hothingz4one

 

It's a hoot watching Bush speak about the death of the Pope. Do you recall his most awkward meeting with the Pope, who basically told him that the war in Iraq was wrong? He couldn't stand the Pope.

 

95 Apr-3 From: lindamallett To: Dayhawk Kim

 

I too, am an Episcopalian. As a Christian sister, I am saddened that such an important figure in the Roman Catholic faith has passed. I don't know a whole lot about Pope John Paul II, but I do know that he loved even his enemies. This is something we as Christians are taught from the day we can talk. He acted this out when he forgave the person that shot him. For the common person, this could instill hatred . The Pope so trusted in our Father that he was able to forgive. I know that he is now with God and he will rest in peace. My sympathies to all Roman Catholics and all Christians.

 

96 Apr-3 From: dman2391 To: Anne

 

 

 

But what good does turning his back on the entire history of his teachings for the whims of mortal men do? God had a clear vision, and if you believe in that God, then what right do we have to change that, to 'interpret' that. Pope's as styles and fads and even popular moral code come and go, but to the Christian, Gods word is forever. I mean, that's why we believe isn't it?

 

 

 

I don't ask you not to have your views, to you these views are very strong, more power to you. Just, I believe, as was the popes. What makes you more right than he that you may judge him so. And in such a position that he can make no retort.

 

 

 

I don't ask you to think different. I just ask that you find a better time and place for such things. Give Catholics even a day to relive the goodness of the Pope before you return to your vehement critique. It is your right, but please, some humanitarian decency for a deceased man, no more. To that end, how would you like it, if on the day of your funeral, men and women came to the please you were put the rest shouting your flaws and failures, trying to damage your legacy. Give him a day of peace, please. He's not as bad as you make him out. In my view, far from it.

 

97 Apr-3 From: wiggy1995 To: erh411706

 

Paul, I will pray for you. As the pope taught there is even hope for someone like you, may God bless you and your family .

 

98 Apr-3 From: asteriscoboricua To: ALL

 

 

 

I am glad he is gone. As a former follower-member of the Catholic Church but still an educated, urban, culturally- Catholic person, I firmly believe John Paul II is personally responsible for enhancing the lives of a few, but ending the lives of many. He unquestionably made some contributions that are worth-noting: he opposed the communist regime and forced changes in many countries behind the iron curtain, he probably travelled the most around the world as well as he probably had the most illuminated understanding of religious conflicts around the world and the need for unity and avoiding war. That said, he has been an obstacle in the natural intellectual evolution of one of the most influential institutions in modern society, the Catholic Church. There have been more people who have abandoned the church or simply stopped believing in it under his reign than potentially any other pope in modern history. By the adoption of his ideas, he failed many. He failed women, he failed gays, he failed every single poor and hungry child in developing countries who has been born to parents who cannot look after them and support them. Where is the Catholic Church and where is John Paul II when these children go unfed or when they die at age 2 because of untreated diseases or malnutrition?.

 

It would certainly be admirable for him to have saved their lives by preventing people from having abortions, but it is far more cruel to impact the birth of children who end up dying shortly after their birth. I would expect the pope to be a vehicle of religious guidance, but along with that guidance there has to be a social context. It is no longer enough to tell people not to have abortions, people need tangible solutions, people need to be educated about sex and pregnancy prevention. You cannot operate under the same assumptions for lay people as you do for the Clergy. Abstinence is a word not known to many and those who know what it means abstain from carrying out what it means!

 

In parallel to the spread of such anachronistic beliefs, the mission of the Catholic church secretly and passive-aggressively continues to be to propagate irresponsible births around the world as a means to have as many born-members as possible, thereby mitigating the inexorable exodus of its membership. This is no different to Islam and some other religions, but I expect more of an institution that has been founded on certain core beliefs that I have chosen to retain close to my values.

 

John XXIII took the church out of the dark ages and John Paul brought it back in. He single-handedly made decisions that did not follow the doctrine of Jesus. He did not love unconditionally, accept unconditionally and certainly behaved like a politician with more expensive vestments. As a pope he had a mandate too big for him to fulfill. He was appointed pope to guide the church followers, both socially and morally. He chose the easy way out, he adhered to the most conservative posture possible without taking into consideration the teachings of Jesus about tolerance and acceptance. I sit here hopeful that whomever comes next will be more progressive, more loving, more tolerant. At the same time, I hope he is not too loving or too tolerant, or he will suffer from the same twist of fate John Paul I did, he may be secretly assassinated by the establishment, out of fear, out of the mandate to keep the church from evolving too much.

 

John Paul II, Heaven, I am not sure he deserves it!

 

J. Flores

 

99 Apr-3 From: Anne To: dman2391

 

 

 

If someone I knew, saw regularly, personally, died, and had his/her good and bad points, I might or might not attend the wake, depending upon what he or she stood for. If it was very upsetting to me, when he/she was alive, what he/she stood for, I would probably not go or particularly mourn him/her, unless he/she was an actual family member with whom I had developed a close relationship. (And I am not talking about the relationship that one has with a public figure such as the Pope.)

 

Now, if the Pope, who, by the way, chose to accept the incredibly influential and powerful job that he accepted, made numerous poor decisions, as, I feel that this Pope did, it would be ridiculous for people not to feel that they could criticise him openly when he died. I have criticized him for years and he is not a family member but a public figure. It goes with the job. This is not a simple case of having respect for the newly deceased.

 

He was a powerful figure who did some good and some harmful things, IMO.

 

100 Apr-3 From: asteriscoboricua To: deadder5

 

sorry, who will you miss? Princess Diana and the pope? you must be into fashionable outfits! they both wore great stuff.

 

101 Apr-3 From: asteriscoboricua To: dman2391

 

 

 

Dear Dman,

 

I didn't realize you had the authority to speak for over a billion people. How dare you represent me as a catholic? You are the one who has to leave this site and continue to succumb in blind ignorance.

 

102 Apr-3 From: mcpat22 To: asteriscoboricua

 

He's right. Remember the phrase "Ignorance is bliss" Totally represents you lol.

 

103 Apr-3 From: mcpat22 To: mcpat22

 

D-man you really need to look at a persons emotions, ambitions and there life's accomplishments. Not what clothes they wore. Anyway anyone got something Smart to say? D-mans idiotic post got the topic off the subject.

 

104 Apr-3 From: lindafrey7 To: ALL

 

I personally did not know much about the Pope. My husband and his family are Catholic; I am not. However, I respect the Catholic faith tremedously. I do admire the Pope's upholding of moral issues; in this day and time, we need that. There aren't many role models in the world left today, and he was one who taught love and compassion, forgiveness, and faith. He will be greatly missed.

 

105 Apr-3 From: mcpat22 To: lindafrey7

 

Well said :-)

 

106 Apr-3 From: youdntknwme87 To: paul26g

 

May Pope John Paul II rest in eternal peace in Heaven.

 

For PAUL26g*......

 

you should be ashamed to have Paul as your name. how can you be so disrespectful about the pope's death.

 

he is POPE JOHN PAUL II, he is and will always be important in catholics and non-catholics around the world. HE REPRESENTS GOD strongly and it looks like you haven't been up to date lately because it seems like you ain't know that.

 

and for you information it ain't just an organization. CATHOLIC is a religion, just like Muslim and Jewish, not an ORGANIZATION.

 

so get your facts straight before you come in here talkin all this sh** .

 

THIS IS ONLY FOR PEOPLE WHO CARE PAUL26g*. so get out the waayyyy ****

 

 

 

107 Apr-3 From: mayhns To: Dayhawk Kim

 

Dear Sir or Madam

 

Couldn't have said it better !! While not a Catholic, I too have admired the work of the man in spite of failing health as he carrried on till the end.

May

 

 

 

108 Apr-3 From: wareswind To: life4teri

 

Yes dear, he was a "liberal." Look up the definition of same. You making judgments of others in His name, is stunningly ironic. You see, he told you not to do that. If you insist on belittling Him with your prejudices, be prepared to be called on what you do.

 

109 Apr-3 From: mcpat22 To: wareswind

 

Well im an usher in St mary church.

 

And when i brought up the food for the poor. I went and put it in the back up the altar and i saw one of the presits was crying. (Because of Pope John pauls death) It just goes to show you the influence he had on the world.

 

He was a good man , spoke 13 different langauges, Was intellectual and a kind generous person.

 

 

 

110 Apr-3 From: wareswind To: morashbob

 

 

 

Sexuality is an instinctual behavior, given us by nature. Most are heterosexual, some are homosexual, fewer are bi sexual. The same is seen in the animal kingdom. It just 'is.' If science cares to figure it all out, well and good. But to decide arbitrarily that something is 'evil, abhorrant, wrong, etc etc' out of an interpretation of a 2000 year old book, is without reason. We can do better than that.

 

 

111 Apr-3 From: gmgs37 To: jimhobbins

 

Why is that so many people call Catholics and other true Christian "ignorant", yet those people preach themselves to be tolerant to everyone? Pope John Paul II was epitomized how a great Pope should act and even though some people claim that he made many mistakes, nobody is perfect except God. If you did not know, this forum was designed for people who wanted to remember all the good things that the Pope did, so if you are to bash the pope, please create your own forum for this. And also, why do so many people insult our believes yet they don't take the time to closely read the holy Scripture and understand what we are talking about.

 

112 Apr-3 From: fightgal2005 To: sumatoronto

 

ummmm, are you calling me a bible-thumper or are you asking me to tell somebody else to shut up? Is this in response to my comment that I thougth the statement "abortion can be a wonderful thing" was warped, that I never heard of anyone celebrating having an abortion? what's that got to do with the bible?

What's your deal?

 

113 Apr-3 From: wareswind To: mcpat22

 

 

 

And when i brought up the food for the poor. I went and put it in the back up the altar and i saw one of the presits was crying. (Because of Pope John pauls death) It just goes to show you the influence he had on the world.

He was a good man , spoke 13 different langauges, Was intellectual and a kind generous person.>>>>>

 

I've no doubt that millions of people mourn his loss, and am not quite sure what you're responding to, here. I'll take your word for it that he was "kind and generous." So are millions of other people in the world, just as millions of others speak more than one language, are good people, and "intellectual."

 

 

114 Apr-3 From: wareswind To: gmgs37

 

 

 

Why is that so many people call Catholics and other true Christian "ignorant", yet those people preach themselves to be tolerant to everyone? Pope John Paul II was epitomized how a great Pope should act and even though some people claim that he made many mistakes, nobody is perfect except God. If you did not know, this forum was designed for people who wanted to remember all the good things that the Pope did, so if you are to bash the pope, please create your own forum for this. And also, why do so many people insult our believes yet they don't take the time to closely read the holy Scripture and understand what we are talking about.>>>>>

 

Gee, I read a 'Christian' post that bashes "liberals." Just wondering why you didn't find that out of place. Perhaps you missed it?

 

115 Apr-3 From: mcpat22 To: wareswind

 

People dont mourn for the Pope just for the hell of it.

Evedentally if so many people cared for the pope and

mourned for him it should show what kind of person he is.

It would be different if people thought of the pope as a bad person

then there would be a reason, but most respect the pope. Not because

he's a liberal, but because of his good nature and his sacrifice,

to serve for god.

 

He served for god. Donated his whole life to it. That must say something.

Just imagine giving your life to god and giving your services to him.

It takes a great commitment and a good person to do that.

 

116 Apr-3 From: azure480 To: paul26g

 

 

 

Because most people do not affect the lives of millions of people, most people do not go around the world to hundreds of countries and give hope to oppressed individuals, because most people do not break down the "walls" of tyranny, most people do not possess the character that he does and use it to help so many people, most people do not head major religions, and most people do not earn the level of respect this man has attained. He has cut across so many levels of division and branched out to people who are ignored by most of the world. That is why "such a fuss" is being made over this man. It is the same way we mourn for presidents, musicians, artists, and activists, they have changed the world, and so we honor them for their contribution and come together as a world to mourn the great void they leave behind. To Catholics by the way, he is chosen by God through divine inspiration so he is more than just a man to this religion, he is almost an envoy for God himself.

 

117 Apr-3 From: dughr To: jimhobbins

 

you're a freak!

 

118 Apr-3 From: blushn80 To: xst0opidkittie

 

 

 

YES HE WAS A MAN CHOSEN BY MEN, BUT THEY WERE MEN INSPIRED BY GOD JUST AS THE MEN WERE WHO WROTE THE BIBLE

 

119 Apr-3 From: arwenmuc To: morashbob

 

 

 

I'm glad you enjoyed reading the story about him. I am not Catholic myself, and until I came into college, I didn't really know any Catholics that were strong Christians, and I was ignorant about a lot of Catholic stuff. I still don't know a lot, but I have some really good friends that are very strong Christians that are Catholic.

 

I think it's really important for non-Catholics to realize that not all of them follow the sterotype of Catholics that we've been exposed to. (This sterotype is that they don't know anything about personal relationships with Jesus, they just go to church, but aren't real believers.)

 

I"ve been to a couple of conferences, even occassionally Campus Crusade stuff in which it is expressed that Catholics are bad, and if someone is a Catholic, they're not saved.

 

So I think it's so, so important for us non-Catholics to realize that there are a lot of Catholics that truly seek after God, that have Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior, and truly love Him...

 

And the fact that Pope John Paul II valued personal relationships with Jesus Christ so much, and really wanted to spread Christ's love should really show something....he was the head of the Catholic Church...so that completely goes against the sterotype about Catholics

 

120 Apr-3 From: blushn80 To: bruinmominwv45

 

I AGREE WITH ALOT OF WHAT YOU SAY, HERE IS THE THING IN THE BIBLE CHRIST SAYS " APON THIS ROCK I SHALL BUILD MY CHURCH" PETER WAS THE ROCK THERE FOR PETER WAS THE FIRST POPE. SO WE HONOR OUR LEADER AS WE DO MARY. WE DO NOT WORSHRIP THEM BUT THEY DESERVE HONOR. JUST AS WE HONOR OUR FAMILY MATRIARCH. AS FAR AS CONFESSION GOES WHAT HARM DOES IT DO HE IS A SERVANT OF THE LORD. IT MAKES ME FEEL BETTER TO GET IT OFF MY CHEST. WE PRAY FOR GOD TO FORGIVE US. THE PRIEST SIMPLY HEARS WHAT HURTS OUR SOULS AND TELLS US WHAT PRAYERS TO SAY. HOWEVER HE MAY NOT FORGIVE ANY SIN AGAINST THE HOLY SPIRIT. I DON'T THINK THE POPE NEEDS OUR PRAYERS, I THINK THE CARDNALS WHO REPLACE HIM DO

 

121 Apr-3 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

I AM A CHILDREN ADVOCATE AND I WILL REMAIN CATHOLIC ASK YOURSELF WHY THIS IS ONLY HAPPENING IN THE US? THE POPE IS ONLY ONE MAN HE HAS CARDNALS AND BISHOPS THAT ORDAINED THESE "PRIESTS" NOT HIM. WE DO NOT EXPECT OUR HEAD TO CONDEM THE SCOUT LEADERS WHO DO THE SAME. WE LEAVE IT TO A LOCAL ATHORITY. IT IS OUR JOB TO KNOW OUR PRIEST AND PROTECT OUR KIDS.

 

122 Apr-3 From: mrpsduc7 To: ALL

 

 

 

It is sad news for many all over the world to learn that Pope John Paul II has died. It is good news that he is at rest and at peace in the care of Jesus Christ, the Good Shepherd, to whom the Pope dedicated his life and many ministries. I pray for the repose of his soul. I will miss him because he gave us the hope of a better world...a world of peace. I cry tears of thanks that you are yourself at peace, Pope John Paul II.

 

There are many legacies Pope John Paul II has left us in the global village. Much of church history and the church in the world will retain his ideas and practices and can reflect upon them. Many things are and will be written about him. It is what he tried to write into the hearts of all who would hear him that matters more.

 

As a result, I believe future generations, and our current generations, will remember him as a minister of and for the peoples of Earth; a Pope of and for the people. In his many years of travel throughout the world, Pope John Paul II touched the lives and hearts of millions with his enduring prayers of hope for a peaceful world. His ministry of love is his greatest gift to all of us, regardless of our faith. Remembering him for that great gift keeps his ministries of love alive in the global village and in our individual lives. As long as we keep our hearts open to them, we shape what we will each remember about him and share with future generations.

 

What you are is God's gift to you; what you become is your gift to God. Pope John, we thank God for God's gift of you to all of us and for what you did with your life as your gift to God. By keeping your memory and your legacies alive now and in the future, the people of the global village will be better able to become themselves "gifts to God". When we strive to become living prayers of hope for a better world....a world of peace....we honor this wonderful Pope for his example. Do we not truly prefer a world of peace?

 

May you rest in God's peace, Pope John Paul II. Thank you for all your gifts to us. Who could not love you because of how you loved/love others? Help us to do what we can to keep world peace a legacy of hope and of reality for all generations.

 

God's blessings on our global village and on all who strive for peace.

 

123 Apr-3 From: blushn80 To: ceolsabhail

 

WE WORSHIP ONLY GOD , WE HONOR HIM AS OUR LEADER LIKE OUR FAMILY MATRIARCH

 

124 Apr-3 From: mec1909217 To: ALL

 

A very poignant vision; and most interesting as I had a similar experience when Diana and Mother Teresa trancended the material world.

Regarding homosexuality, it's a known fact that babies are born with both sex organs, (i.e. hermaphrodites) as well as two heads, extra boy parts, etc. In the past these creations were destroyed, which is unthinkable today. I've seen the twin girls who share one body, (two distinct heads), and after a moment I came to see them as normal. Christ made no distinction as what kind of a neighbor we are to love. Only to love.

 

125 Apr-3 From: wildjen6 To: bednarfp

 

Pope John Paul the Second was a truly Christian man. Even in his death he used the opportunity to show that suffering is part of life. As a cradle Catholic I learned more from him about the pope because he did not hide in Vatican City as other previous Italian popes. He united Americans with Europeans in his love for the church and Christ. He tried in his final years to absolve the Catholic church of its mistakes in history. For the first time in my life I felt like America had its own pope. We go to know him as a person.

 

126 Apr-3 From: x78229 To: ALL

 

 

 

As a practicing, devout Catholic male, I would like to remember Pope John Paul II as....a moral man who did not let the changing world and its temptation snare him into changing his views about what is morally right nfor all of us both catholic and non-catholics. Though I expect others to disagree. He helped me see what strrength lies within each one of us when we endure suffering such as he did to prevent communism punish him for his beliefs. He dodged communism when he was affiliated with an underground theater of actors, who were forbidden from diplaying their art form(s). But what inspires me most about his final hours of suffering is for me to go on with the drudge of seeking employment. I say drudge bacause I see no light in me getting a permanet job such as I dastardly need it as of yesterday! I am broke and seeking a sign form out Lord as to how to change this from eating me up. I have been seeking permanent employment for a long time now. I have been supporting myself through tight budgeting from my income made through temporary assignments. And yet I strive very hard to obtain that permanent, full-time, career-oriented job. But after seeing how my beloved Pope refused hospitalization in his final days of his life because of the idea of being hooked up to life support equipment gave no meaning to a leader (as himself) form setting the example of us to die a God's way of death through his grace of us living a meaningful and christian way of dying through paind and suffering rememberance of Jesus Christ's final hours. He (Pope John Paul II)showed strength and faith into entrance into heaven to our beloved Savior and Holy Father in Heaven by having the stations of the cross read to him and him seeking strength (knowing his time here on Earth coming to an end) through faith in our Lord and Savior. So in essence my upcoming week will be somber because I feel the loss of an inspirational man not because of the fact he lead my faith. But because he condemed wrong doing from injustice to man from the powerful, merciless and exploiter who otherwise in ther own eyes would gain satisfaction from their own wrongdoings. Without being reprimanded from a voice for the victim(s). So my week coming up will be both challenging (from the fact that I am seeking a job plus I am behind in month of rents and not able to meet this month's obligations) but it will also be one of saddness from the fact a world inspirational leader whom I feel now I will look up to. Especially, since he was my pope I admired from my teeenage age years to my now present adulthood. I wish this passing to be one especial for all of your readers whether they are Catholic or not to keep vigilance of what God expects from all of us during this time of an ever changing hendonism, materialism world that will corrupt us all unless we turn to our Lord and Saviour for guidance and our hearts turned over to him before it is too late. After all we were placed on this earth through God's will and love for us.

 

 

 

127 Apr-3 From: mnchubs To: markbuor2

 

How dare you say things like that. As a catholic I am appauled with that comment. Truth is he experienced the worst of things anyone could experience for example: the holocaust, the deadly affects of communism, and attempted assasination. He came to this power to fix those things and prevent them from happening again. Also he had the goodness to forgive the man who shot him. So he was a great person, so get your facts and opinions straight.

 

128 Apr-3 From: happenb To: thatshot427

 

I agree with you, I am not a practising Catholic, but I am still a believer, I feel that without peace around this crazy world, none of us will ever have peace within ourselves. I feel that this is too much of a materialic world, but without love and faith we have nothing. Peace be with you

 

129 Apr-3 From: missyakaspicy To: thatshot427

 

 

I think that people should not cry and become upset too much of the fact that he has passed. He has moved on God bless his soul and he is at peace and so should everyone else. He does not have to suffer anymore and I am sure he would tell everyone not to cry because he is at peace

 

130 Apr-3 From: ladyhawk11667 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

After the passing of the pope, I could not help but think of Sister Theresa, and Princess Diana. The lord is very lucky. For he has our three greatest humanatarians at his side now. Tho it is very sad, of his passing, I hope now that the three of them are in heaven looking down on us, with compassion and hope, for our war torn world . Now that they are gods soilders in heaven, maybe they can still carry on their good work with the Lord. To unite our world, and bring peace to us all. I like what one person posted earier. I thought it very touching. It was posted on the prayer forum. That Terri was holding the gates open for the the Great John Paul II. May they enter heaven together. amen.

 

131 Apr-3 From: ladyhawk11667 To: jimhobbins

 

I couldn't have said it better. Very well put John. May the Pope and Terri enter the heavenly gates together . KY. USA

 

132 Apr-3 From: jerseystreetbarn To: x78229

 

 

 

DearX

 

heres a differtn perspective.

 

the pope spoke against the rich people and yet he lived in splendor, he spoke out against poverty and homlessness yet he condemed abortion and birth contorl for the poor people of 3rd world countries. ,as he prayed for peace he welcomed heads of state whos governmet continues to kill people..... he called for rights for women , as long as they dont have equality in the church as priests ...he wanted the shavio life prolonged but he denied tubes and life extension applications for himself. He was against the distibuting condoms and bunred books on communism, yet gives pedophiles new jobs.

 

easy to figure out why i left the church...

 

133 Apr-3 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

Child advocate or not you have NO proof that molestation by Catholic clergy is not happening worldwide. I believe it is. I believe it is merely more reported here because Americans stand less in fear and awe of the power of the church. At least when the Scouts find a pedophile they turn him in to proper authority and remove him from membership. On the other hand the church covers up the whole matter and quietly transfers the criminal to another parish or diocese to continue abusing children. Just as the captain of a ship is ultimately responsable for all that happens on board, so is the Pope responsable for the actions of all the clergy. Instead of making excuses for abuse by clergy, you as a catholic should demand that your new pope issue a directive that all clergy involved in abuse or cover up of abuse will be immediately excommunicated. The same directive should include the certanty that abusers should be immediately be turned over to proper authority. The credibility of the entire catholic church is at stake here. You can probably tell I am not catholic, but my sister-in-law is a cathloic lay minister. She feels much the same way I do. She petitions the Vatican for excommunication of abusive clergy and for justice for abuse victims. If you are not part of the solution......you are part of the problem. Please remember one sin erases a thousand good works. Will you join her in protecting all children or will you continue to make weak excuses that someone else......other than you makes the decisions? If all U.S. catholics stood up and demanded that abuse stop It surely would be reduced if not stopped altogether. There is no creature on this earth lower than a child molestor. There is a special place in hell for them. Next door to that place there is a place for those who will not expose and condemn them. I believe John Paul II's weak words of disaproval on the matter put him in that second place. God makes the judgements, I don't claim to know His thoughts. Jesus chased the moneylenders from the temple.......I can only imagine what He would do to a child molestor!

 

134 Apr-3 From: youdntknwme87 To: arwenmuc

 

ight ight lets get real. Ok you talkin about sterotype catholics, whom you mentioned are the ones that go to church but dont really believe in him. Ok. Now if we didnt believe in him why go to church?

 

Well listen here buddy, people might not know everything about their religion, but they BELIEVE that Jesus is REAL and that he did in deed save the world from evil. Now i been to catholic school i learned much about religion, people who do sin like MORTAL sin ( sex ,adultery,thinking of other people pervertly while married, etc) OR just MINOR sins(..not going to church, the 10 commandments basically) and DONT OR DIDNT KNOW about it, go straight to heaven, NOW, if you are commiting to these sins KNOWING THAT IT IS A SIN, well then you go straight to HELL, unless you are TRUTHFULLY SORRY and confess.

 

NOw it aint really your busniess to actually say many catholics are not true believers, cuz guess what? you dont know HOW they were raised you dont know WHATS going on in their minds now do you MISTER OR MISSES JUDGING- PEOPLE- KNOW -IT- ALL??

 

and those conferences about catholics are bad and they are not saved well, THEY are being STUPID AND IGNORANT, and so are YOU AGAIN!!

 

and im glad for you to have catholic friends and be a believer but DO NOT act like you better then any one else, cuz listen buddy YOU ARE NOT.

 

135 Apr-3 From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

 

>> Just as the captain of a ship is ultimately responsable for all that happens on board, so is the Pope responsable for the actions of all the clergy. Instead of making excuses for abuse by clergy......<<<

 

 

 

He didn't make excuses for them. "The abuse which has caused this crisis is, by every standard, wrong and rightly considered a crime by society: it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God," said the Pope. "The policy is to expel pedophiles from the priesthood and hand them over to civil authorities."

 

 

 

 

 

-

[Jeb]

136 Apr-3 From: CG47**** To: Dayhawk Kim

 

All I have to say is the Pope did a wonderful job here on

earth as one of God's leaders.And he helped many people

see the light of God.The Pope traveled all over the world trying to share the blessings that he had recieved himself,from our holy father In heaven.I don't feel sad,

infact,I feel very happy for the Pope.He has reach a goal that so many of us are still trying to reach.I thank

God each day,for helping me to know what his love really

means in this life.With out God in my life,I know I would'nt have a life.I pray God will always be with each

and every one of us, that is left here to go on fighting

life's battle.

CG47****

 

137 Apr-3 From: day2sexi05 To: jimhobbins

 

 

 

Hey there John, I believe what you said was right but why should a daughter have to keep, a child that just because of mistake they brought into this world. People shouldn't have to deal with the pain of that going on in the world They shouldn't have to be subjected to that type of treatment ever!!!

 

~Saade Matthews~

 

138 Apr-3 From: thinkso13 To: bednarfp

 

 

 

That's what the dead Pope said but no action was taken so he condones by inaction! Meanwhile more kids raped by supposedly celibate clergy! what a joke! Hell got a place for John Paul II!

 

 

 

139 Apr-3 From: zeldafanfreak To: Dayhawk Kim

 

this is just really sad because i am polish and he has the first polish pope ever.

 

 

My whole country is mourning him.

 

 

God Rest Your Soul , Pope John Paul ll.

 

140 Apr-3 From: zeldafanfreak To: thinkso13

 

That is mean.

 

141 Apr-3 From: arwenmuc To: youdntknwme87

 

 

 

response to #134:

 

You completely misunderstood my intentions, and what I was trying to say.

 

I wasn't trying to say something bad about Catholics. I was trying to correct the thinking that a lot of non-Catholics have about Catholics.

 

I was not around Catholics that were strong Christians until college. So I had a misperception about Catholics, and there were a lot of other non-Catholics have these same misperceptions.

 

I was just saying that a sterotype exists in the non-Catholic world. I do not agree with that kind of thinking. When people assume all Catholics are not real believers, it makes me mad.

 

However, there are a lot of Christians, both Catholic and Protestants that are Christian only in name...that don't really believe. I'm not accusing anyone here...but a lot of Christians just attack the Catholics for it

 

But I also know that there are a lot of people that really live for Christ, both Catholic and Protestant.

 

I'm not trying to stereotype all Catholics myself, I'm just stating that there is a kind of thinking that a lot of Christians have about Catholics....and I am happy that it is unfounded and not true.

 

I am not trying to act like I'm better than anyone. Perhaps this is a topic I shouldn't have even brought up. I am sorry if I have hurt anyone here. That was not my intention at all.

 

Perhaps too, I did not explain myself very well, and I am sorry for the confusion.

 

Do you understand better what I meant to say?

 

142 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: mrdl1230

 

Not sure how to take what you said.....

 

143 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: jonsmizzle11

 

Oh stop

 

144 Apr-3 From: xsex0nth3beachx To: jimhobbins

 

 

 

Hi my name is Alyse im 14 years old...i think that it is very sad thet the Pope died! i am NOT Cathlick im Messianic...i still do respect how Cathlics feel about the Pope! I am so sorry to every one out there..i do know the pope was a great man and did wonderful things to all!I wish u all good luck and God Bless

 

145 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: princessjill29

 

Thankyou!!! What are all of you doing? Very sad

 

146 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: thinkso13

 

Grow up!

 

147 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: codifex

 

You need to read a Bible more....really read this time

very sad person

 

148 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: sumatoronto

 

Amen!

 

149 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: cathee002

 

All I can say is...sad, very sad

 

150 Apr-3 From: jodko1 To: paul26g

 

 

 

Paul26g, did you make an effort and tried to read just a little about that "one man's" life? you would get the answer very quick. don't be such an ignorant.

 

151 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: markbuor2

 

You are a coward and a sad waste of earth's space....How dare you!

 

152 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: bluesboy16

 

Your wrong, you go and listen to a Latin Mass and if can walk out of that Chruch without being moved

then there is something really wrong with you.

 

153 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: ALL

 

Let's just pray for him and the world and stop all of this other crap!

 

154 Apr-3 From: bcwnuk To: hothingz4one

 

That would be a grave mistake

 

155 Apr-3 From: Geddie080390 To: thatshot427

 

I also did not know pope john paul, but most everyone knew of him and his kindness to all an all the good things he did for all whom opend their hearts to his teachings and beliefs. i am baptist, but i truely admired him . now he is with our lord an no longer in pain, he is healed and watchs over all his followers with the same grace he did while on earth.

 

156 Apr-3 From: arwenmuc To: ALL

 

 

 

I'm very sorry that I brought that topic up. I shouldn't have....because it really didn't help anything. Everyone, I messed up. Can you all forgive me please? Even though I didn't mean to make it sound negative, at least one person was hurt by it, and since the comment was unneccessary, I'm sorry.

 

I respect all Christians, no matter what denomination, and the last thing I want to do is hurt another Christian. Please accept my apology, and forget that I ever brought up that other subject.

 

From what I have heard of John Paul II, (which isn't a lot), he was a great man, who really grew in his faith, was big on spreading it to the world, loved others, and built his life on Jesus Christ. He was an amazing person.

 

157 Apr-3 From: juleszn To: jerseystreetbarn

 

 

 

The Pope spoke out against the rich? How so? The Pope did not choose to live in "splendor", as you claim. He was a humble man....and if you know anything about Catholicism, everything thing that he wears(or any member of the clergy for that matter) has symbolic meaning. Much of what the Pope has(as far as living quarters/vehicles and such) is mostly there for his protection. The people of the Catholic Church want to make sure that he is well-protected and taken care of. I think the attempted assassination of John Paul II is a prime example of why these precautions are essential. The relationship between the Pope and the rest of the Church is reciprocal(meaning he takes care of us and we take care of him). He spoke out against contraceptives in general, not just to the poor. Pope John Paul II loved the poor and his travelling and compassion for them is a testament to that.

 

He welcomed all peoples, despite their beliefs. THAT is anything but hypocritical. For example, he disagreed with President Bush concerning the War in Iraq(and he definately made his statements clear), but he also shared much respect for President Bush as a fellow human being and Christian. The Pope NEVER condemned anyone. He was angered at times I'm sure at what has been going on in the world, but he never got violent about his beliefs(neither physically or verbally).

 

As far as the women in the church goes....it is Catholic tradition, as you probably know, that the priest is supposed to be a representation of Christ. Since Christ was a man, it makes perfect sense to me to stay true to that representation BUT if we're realistic about it, it might not be this way forever anyhow. In our time, we might see a woman priest....but that's not an issue to me. I'm a woman and I'm not offended by the fact that I can't become a priest. I know that the female role in the Church is just as important...mostly because we honor the Virgin Mary, perhaps the most important woman to have ever lived for obvious reasons.

 

The Terri Schaivo incident was different, in that there was no solid proof that Terri did NOT want to be sustained by a feeding tube. The Pope, however, did declare his wishes....there's no disputing that.

 

And I honestly don't know what communism and pedophilia have to do with each other, but as far as the child molestations go, you cannot solely blame the Pope for what has happened. The bishops and archbishops of those affected archdioceses have more control over those particular situations just because they are on site. I agree that it would have helped for him to make more statements against what those priests did. During the time, however, that most of these abuse stories arose, Pope John Paul II has been very sick. He was disgusted with what those men did, just like we all were. And unfortunately, it is humanly impossible for him to know every single new priest that joins the clergy, so don't take your anger out on this one man. Shouldn't you be addressing your anger at the criminals themselves?

 

I'm sure that if you had all of the responsibilities of Pope, you might reconsider all of your uneducated statements. It's very easy to jump to conclusions though, isn't it?

 

158 Apr-3 From: shawnpnpgh To: paul26g

 

You know you must not have a heart to say sommthing like that . I feel bad for you cause when its time for you to be judged you will have to answer to the all mighty

 

159 Apr-3 From: thinkso13 To: bcwnuk

 

 

 

I grown up as much as U want.......I old enuf to be yer daddy and smart enuf not to be.......shutup if U aint got somthing intelligent to say

 

 

 

160 Apr-3 From: bigpoppa7390 To: paul26g

 

 

 

I agree in a sense that in life some people seem to be honored when they die more than others. But what you say about him not being chosen by God is a lack of knowledge at least acknowleding the faith catholics have. Every Cardinal who votes cannot see the outside world once they are in the voting process, and since in our faith every cardinal are "holy men" and therefore a bit "closer to god" then others, they all preside in choosing by asking God in ther conscience, "Lord make me make the best choice"

 

And therefore, the choice of Pope is a choice from God in our belief. Perhaps not in yours, but remember, this is a nearly 2000 year tradition.

 

One cannot say he runs an organization, Look at this man, who else have u seen embrace people and the people crying in happiness, for they feel they are closest to God in his presense??? That is not just any man, that is a great man, a holy man. And me being only 16 years of age, I know no other pope, no other symbol of the church, and for that I feel as though I have lost a grandfather. Many across the world feel the same. God Bless John Paul, may we meet him again when we too go down the path to be judged by God and the kingdom of heaven. Let us mourn, but let us rejoice the life he had, and all he did for all people, of all regions, of all religions.

 

161 Apr-3 From: thinkso13 To: zeldafanfreak

 

 

 

Not mean Just real get real!

 

 

 

162 Apr-3 From: shawnpnpgh To: erh411706

 

I guess you know what goes on in the real world Shut Up you heartless bast**d you need to grow up i wouldnt want to be u when you meet god

 

163 Apr-3 From: juleszn To: fightgal2005

 

 

 

Yeah, I completely agree. I think abortion is just an excuse. I could have been aborted when I was a baby, but my birth mother graciously allowed me to live(she was impoverished and abandoned by my birth father). Because of her, I have a wonderful adoptive family who loves me as their own. There are too many couples out there who want to have babies but can't. Adoption is ALWAYS an alternative. I don't care who you are or what your financial situation is. It's easy to dismiss a life when you can't hear their voice. I feel as if I have the responsibility to speak out for those who cannot, because I WAS that unborn child.

 

And I apologize for going off on this tangent about abortion in a forum meant to honor the memory of our Pope. Love to you John Paul II!

 

164 Apr-3 From: shawnpnpgh To: trestt

 

You know what you really need help. Wait untill you are judged and see what happens to you because you thought you needed to talk bad about the pope. Wow i really feel bad for you.

 

165 Apr-3 From: trestt To: shawnpnpgh

 

 

 

All that the catholic church ever did was create guilt in people's mind and control them through that. I decided years ago not to be a part of such organization. All I'm saying is that if it comes to the guilt that church imposes, he had a pretty big one to talk with God about...

 

 

 

166 Apr-3 From: shawnpnpgh To: Anne

 

ok moron the man just died. If you would actually sit down and take a look at all the accomplishments he has made throughout his entire life and wrote about that you might of actually had an intelligent response there. But unfortunately you didnt. He helped with a lot of issues. One man can not fix the world. He was not God, but his greatest messenger. So keep your ignorant opinions to yourself. Thank you and have a nice day.

 

167 Apr-3 From: shawnpnpgh To: mrdl1230

 

Ok why dont you just grow up. Who cares that women cant be priests. Thats why there are nuns idiot. Dont go around judging the pope because of something stupid like that. He was a good man. And i am a woman im just using my boyfriends screen name.... So take your little childish sarcasm and shove it up your a--

 

168 Apr-3 From: kramerdjr To: trestt

 

 

 

>All that the catholic church ever did was create guilt in people's mind and control them through that. I decided years ago not to be a part of such organization. All I'm saying is that if it comes to the guilt that church imposes, he had a pretty big one to talk with God about...<<

 

Nah, don't give the Catholics the credit fo creating "guilt". It was us Jews that invented it. Heck, we feel guilty about everything. Jews have cornered the market on "guilt".

 

As far as Pope John Paul II, he was indeed a very great Pope, who helped to heal the old wounds between the religions. May he rest in peace.

 

David

 

-

 

 

 

169 Apr-3 From: katie9ryan To: blushn80

 

Yes. The people bow to the Church and its teachings, not Church to the people's changing "lifestyles." Rules within the Church may change, but not the principles central to the teachings of Christ. If the Church bows to popular opinion, it loses its reason for being. Pope John Paul II led a life as an example. His life is the exemplar of Christ's teachings. Using his life to reach out to all people, everywhere, the Pope taught lessons of universal love, mercy, forgiveness and strength of the spirit. His teachings uphold the value of all life. He upheld the intrinsic value of human life as a value within itself, as the essence of a human-being is the human spirit. He faced two totalitarian systems which denied the power of God and the significance of the human spirit. He gave his life to God, to serve God and to serve all human souls. He had more armies on his side than did the Nazis or the communists. On his side, he had the armies of God, and said, "Be not afraid," affirming the teachings of Christ, "Be not afraid, I am with you, always." He affirmed Christ's teachings, that man may kill the bodies of men, but not the souls of men.

 

170 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: paul26g

 

Listen a--hole its a big deal because he was such a great person. Everyone has heard of the pope and millions of people have listened to what he had to say so it was really sad when he died.

 

171 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: brooklynbud69

 

Maybe you should learn how to read. Just because the media didnt spend alot of time talking about how the pope and the catholic church handled the situation with priests molesting young children doesnt mean they didnt try to do something. You seriously make me sick. You probably worship the devil or something anyway so go do that and keep your comment to yourself.

 

172 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: erh411706

 

Well apparently you dont have anything to do with religion so dont talk about what you dont know.

 

173 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: waving2uhello

 

wow that was really funny. You need to be waving hello to my foot up your a--.

 

174 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: trestt

 

Well i already dealt with you idiot under the name Shawnpnpgh so if you got something to say talk to me.

 

175 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: mrdl1230

 

I already dealt with you too under the name of Shawnpnpgh so if you got somthing to say then talk to me.

 

176 Apr-3 From: katie9ryan To: bruinmominwv45

 

The Pope was the shepard of his flock. He humbly served us all. In his service he was a great shepard, and, perhaps, a saint.

 

177 Apr-3 From: jenn131582 To: dthmtl3

 

Abortion can be a wonderful thing? I dont think so moron. Its not up to anyone in this world to stop or take a life. The child didnt ask to be brought into this messed up world but dont just kill it. Give it a chance. There are couples who cant have children who would love to adopt a child. And about the overpopulation thing. If people would learn to start using birth control and things like that this wouldnt be a problem. These women need to start taking responsibility for their actions instead of taking the easy way out and acting like killing a living thing doesnt matter.

 

178 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

who cares. Condoms dont really do anything anyways. If you had a brain you would know that they break and arent a solution. how dare you , how dare you my a--. How dare you judge the pope. Who are you to judge anyone. And are you so stupid as to say this and not really know why he didnt suggest using condoms? He didnt suggest using condoms because they promote having sex before you are married. Now let me ask you, why dont you use common sense????

 

179 Apr-4 From: grennma To: jenn131582

 

 

 

Dearest Jenn, this discussion board was about a man who found enough love in his heart to forgive the very man who almost took his life away. He is truly a remarkable man who patiently showed human beings that there is more to life than bitterness. I think we can all learn from his life work. Just pray for those who don't understand and hope that God will guide us all to learn how to "forgive others for they know not what they do". I heard a beautiful saying recently that I would like to share with you... "the worst prison... is a closed heart" by The Great Pope John Paul II.

 

180 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: jonsmizzle11

 

You know what. Take you stupid born again saved baptist crap and shove it up your a--. Apparently he had to be pure to become the pope. The whole purpose of confession is that you go in the little room where the priest is you tell him your sins and he obsolves you from your sins, blesses you and lets you know that you are forgiven. Some people like to talk to people about their problems they like to get it off their chest. Then they like to be reassured from a priest that they are forgiven. Some people just need that reassurance. So i dont even want to talk about your born again saved sh*t cuz some of you need help...... When my grandmother was dying of cancer in her home a couple of people who were all about the saved born again crap came to visit her. They told her she was going to hell because she was Catholic....Oh that is real cool to say to someone on their death bed. Think before you write your little comments if you know nothing about the Catholic religion.

 

181 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

So how do you know he didnt do anything about the child abuse going on.??? Where you there?? Did you secretly live with the Pope and the Vatican? I dont think so....And how about if people didnt go around and have sex with everything they would be getting AIDS. He didnt permit the use of condoms cuz they promote having sex before you are married. hello, start thinking here buddy. Its not up to you to judge what someone does.

 

182 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: markbuor2

 

 

 

THANK GOD YOU ARE NOT A DECIDING FACTOR. DISPICABLE? WHAT WAS DISPICABLE ABOUT...

 

FIGHTING FOR BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS,

 

BONDING MANY FAITHS

 

REACHING OUT TO ALL

 

MAN THE THING YOU HAVE DONE IN YOUR LIFE MUST SURPASS ALL THIS AND MORE...

 

183 Apr-4 From: grennma To: Anne

 

 

 

How can you state he ignored the homosexual community? One would have to first acknowledge it before they can address it. His stand on this issue has never wavered and for that I commend him. Although I do not agree, one would have to ask why. The answer is simple Anne, in his eyes and the churches eyes, homosexuality is an abomination. And for years the church has always addressed their objections to homosexuality and birth control. Has the congregation always followed the Church's beliefs? I know many who didn't but still went to church. There is something to be said about abstinence. My question to you is.. "Why is that concept so hard to swallow?" I think we are all going the wrong way with this subject. I think the Pope was very compassionate towards others. Why should the Church address the issues with the American's failures in the Catholic Church. Let's hold the American Catholic Church accountable for their own actions and address them head on. There comes a time when we American's need to stop pointing fingers and takecare of our own business. Isn't that why were are here in the first place? To create a "city of lights"? Someone forgot to pay the electric bill cause the light is dimming folks!

 

184 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: princessjill29

 

Thank you. Im getting tired of reading all the negative things about the pope that are in here. Its supposed to be about the memories of the pope and prayers not about anything else. Come on now the man just died.

 

185 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: bruinmominwv45

 

Ok, no one is saying he is God. Yes he is a servant of god but he was chosen to LEAD all the other servants. You know sorry if you dont like that all the millions of Catholics out there respect him so much and want to celebrate his life and everything he did for the Catholic Church as a whole....and even non catholics....

 

186 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

PROTEST IS ONE THING CONDEMING IS ANOTHER. FOR MANY WE LOST ONE OF OUR OWN, AND YOU CRITISIZE ALL HIS HARD WORK. HE SUFFERED MUCH WHEN HE WAS YOUNG. I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT AS ONE PERSON YOU HAVE DONE FOR HUMAN KIND? WHAT WAS HIS CRIME TEACHING US TO WEAR BLIDERS AND LOVE ALL REGARDLESS?

 

187 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: dman2391

 

WELL PUT

 

188 Apr-4 From: prettygirl841 To: thatshot427

 

yes i agree with you i didnt know the pope,but so sorry for his lose & ours. but now he is in gods hands now , & he he is at peace now and can rest.

 

189 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: grennma

 

Kudos to you Grennma! The Pope always stood by what he believed. Even those who didn't agree with his stance, I think appreciated the fact that he was always very candid and honest. He always made his points with extreme clarity. His opinions were stated with the sincerest of intentions.

 

190 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: thinkso13

 

wow your message is just so wonderful...First of all how do you know nothing was done to the priests about the molesting. Were you there with them??? Probably not. Not everything is going to be on the news idiot. And apparently you cant be from any religion saying the pope is dead amen!!! Praising someones death is wrong idiot. I hate to be there when you die and are about to be judged cuz i dont see heaven in your future as-hole.....You seriously need help you might want to get yourself checked out before someone beats the sh*t out of you

 

191 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: sumatoronto

 

why dont you shut up..If you dont like what your so called "bible thumpers" are saying then dont read it........or better yet DONT RESPOND I think that would be a better choice

 

192 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: wareswind

 

FYI ANIMALS ARE ONLY HOMOSEXUAL IF A SEX ORAN DOES NOT DROP CAUSING A FEMALE SENT YOU NEVER SEE 2 FEMALES . A 2000 YEAR OLD BOOK HAS MORE CREDABILITY THAN YOU

 

193 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

It is true that the Pope and our President have disagreed concerning the War in Iraq, but you're forgetting that they shared many beliefs as well. One example: Bush and the Pope very much support the right to life, one of the most principle parts of the Catholic Church. Despite their different views, they shared a mutual respect for each other. I have no idea where you came to the conclusion that Bush hated the Pope.

 

194 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: cathee002

 

Hey moron, no one said he was a god. Like i had to explain to another idiot on here he was a servant of god but he was chosen to LEAD all the other servants. He has helped a lot of people so the fact that you have the nerve to talk about him and the Catholic religion like that just makes me sick.. Apparently you are not a religious person so next time something says share your memories and prayers JUST SAY NO!!

 

195 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: jerseystreetbarn

 

YOU HAVE NO CLUE... FYI HE CAME FROM POVERTY. GOD DOES NOT MAKE MISTAKES WHEN GOD CREATES LIFE WE ARE NOT TO DESTROY IT (READ MY OTHER POSTS SO I CAN STOP REPEATING MYSELF. WHAT WOULD YOU KNOW OF POVERTY?

 

196 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: ceolsabhail

 

Wow. Ive read so many negative things about the pope on here today. And the only comment on here that makes sense is one from an Atheist. Think about that. Your the only one with a brain and a conscience(dont think i spelled that right) ok one of the only ones. Sorry you being an Atheist has nothing to do with it but you know what im saying right? The pope was a human being just like everyone else and ive seen things like amen the pope is dead and all kinds of other disgusting stuff that makes me sick. So ceolsabhail I would like to thank you.

 

197 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: cathee002

 

Well i think that you are ignorant and not the catholics...

 

198 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

AS I SAID BEFORE IT IS OUR JOB TO PROTECT OUR KIDS. I NEVER DENIED ITS HAPPENING I SIMPLY BELIEVE IN THE US THERE IS MORE CORRUPTION. I ALSO THINK THERE ARE SOME FALSE ALAGATIONS HAPPENING FOR THE ALMIGHTY $$$$$. I BELIEVE THAT THE POPE HAS LESS TO DUE WITH WHAT OUR BISHOPS ARE DOING WE DON'T EXPECT BUSH TO CONTROL SUCH CRIMES. I DO EXPECT OUR BISHOPS TO DO MORE I GO TO A PRIEST I KNOW I CAN TRUST... HE DOES NOT WORK WITH THE ALTER BOYS HE HAS A MARRIED COUPLE DO THAT. I NEVER IMPLIED WE SHOULD SWEEP IT UNDER A RUG JUST EXPECT MORE FROM OUR LOCAL CATHOLIC COMMUNITY. I WILL REMAIN CATHOLIC IT ISN'T JUST A RELIGION IT'S MY WAY OF LIFE

 

199 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: markbuor2

 

Are you Catholic?? If not then who cares what you think. Dont judge him. You need some mental help man. you are the bastard. If you are not a catholic than just shut up about the whole issue.

 

200 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: bluesboy16

 

Who really cares what you think.... I think you are a sham. You need help.

 

201 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: dabub242

 

Do you even know what you are talking about. Why dont you go talk to all the people he has helped?? You think one person can help every single person in the whole world? If so then you go out and do what he did jacka-s. Think before you speak.

 

202 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

you are really an idiot....just remember that

 

203 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: dman2391

 

yep i agree with dman2391....Get Out ignorant people

 

204 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

post your damn protests somewhere else this is supposed to be a place to remember the pope and everything he has done. Not to belittle him

 

205 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

What the hell are you talking about? Who cares if he is a family member or not. And yes it is having respect for the newly deceased cause this forum is supposed to be about respecting the pope not putting him down. If he made some mistakes so what? What the hell have you done in your life that was so good. by the looks of it nothing if you have to be on here giving 243 responses about how much of a bad person you think he was. Just shut up already.

 

206 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: asteriscoboricua

 

How dare YOU to think you can speak for over a billion people. How dare YOU for having the nerve for thinking you are a catholic..

 

207 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: jerseystreetbarn

 

Youre an idiot.

 

208 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: grennma

 

I know and im sorry for being so bitter with everyone. But these negative people just make me so mad cuz they dont even know what they are talking about. Thank you grennma

 

209 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: jenn131582

 

I understand how you feel. It hurts me personally to hear people bashing such a wonderful man.(I cried for quite some time when I heard that he died) But I think the most important thing to remember is what he has meant to you in your life. Share those positive things that you think he modeled. That is how we can best honor his memory.

 

210 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: arwenmuc

 

you should be sorry you heartless createn.

 

211 Apr-4 From: zoro03012002 To: paul26g

 

Exactly my thoughts buddy. Listen this guy was just a man in an organization which is a man made religion. It is not from GOD and was not created by GOD. It had no manifestation of GOD and the Holy father is not Hollier than you or me or any other man . The Pope was the head or boss of a huge money machine powered by the fatih of misleaded souls who give their money to such an organization in the name of GOD . I say let the dead bury their dead. The Pope and the other cardinals and bishops and fathers are being misguided . They eat good and don't have to live in the real world and make a living like everyone else. The fathers who are all just men aspire to one day at least one of them rise to becoming a cardinal are not pure of heart NO NOT ONE of them. Thats been proven by thier conduct with innocent and trusting children . Their lust is the same as any other mans lust . Period end of story . And to call a mere man a HOLY anything is wrong and this religion known as the Catholic church will one day cease to exist.

 

212 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: juleszn

 

you need to shut the f*** up

 

213 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: zoro03012002

 

look you have no right to talk bad about the pope.so

shut up.

 

214 Apr-4 From: mezzoprano To: ALL

 

As one who seeks to be a fully devoted radical Christian (though I am not a Catholic), I have been most impressed by John Paul 11's fearlessness. By this I mean his apparantly uncompromisingly loyalty to the Gospel, evidenced by his boldness in giving many a hard and fast "no" to those who would seek to have things such as birth control, gay marriage and a females in the priesthood allowed by the Catholic church. How many of would compromise our convictions for the sake of popularity, fear of losing followers,being hated and rejected or simply presenting the church as strict, and too "old-fashioned" and intolerant. People think the Church who think the Church should "change" and meet what they perceive to be THEIR needs, should remember that and be thankful that as much as the world will change, GOD NEVER CHANGES, NOR WILL HE, else we have no rock to stand on. Though it be unpopular, I long to be so unashamed of the Gospel. My heart goes out to all Catholics as they grieve the loss of a truly Godly leader.

 

215 From: ALL To: ALL

 

 

 

216 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: waving2uhello

 

that is so rude.you must beleive in the devil.

 

217 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: trestt

 

why you heartless witch.how dare you.who the hell do you think you are.talking about the

pope.he was a great man.you must be to blind to see that.he wanted peace in the world.he got his wish.the devil must be in you or else you wouldn't be talking like that.so you need to

shut up.

 

218 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: laxerlou248

 

ya.you createn

 

219 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: sumatoronto

 

will you shut up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

220 Apr-4 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

I said nothing about Bush here. I question your way of life.....U depend on one local priest to protect your kids........I want the Pope to protect all children. Expand your view to include the whole world! The catholic church is full of child abusers! Your local priest may be an exception. The root of the problem goes much deeper than that. You are blind if you can't see that. I feel sorry for you in your ignorance. The problem is the unrealistic vow of chastity that none of your clergy lives up to. Blind faith is worse than no faith at all. Open your eyes and your mind! Talking to U is like trying to teach a pig to sing. It does no good and it annoys the pig.

[Jeb]

221 From: ALL To: ALL

 

 

 

222 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

yes i want the priests who are right here to protect the kids here. it is unrealistic to expect a man a world away to goven our community when our bishop who ordained the priest are to govern them. i know you did not mention Bush i was comparing the 2 we expect our local athority to deal with crimes against all. what is the difference? one man can only do so much I don't expect one priest to do it. I expect all of us in the catholic community to do so. it is not so unreal to do with out sex i did until I was married my grandmother has done it for over 30 years. nuns do it too. don't tell me what we are capable of. sigling out our leader does nothing for your effort, all you do is offend people who are in mourning. honest abe ended slavery who's to say that he couldn't have done it sooner? we don't know what the pope would have done had he not passed. I pray the our next pope does deal with the issue but do not mock what our leader has done. what have you done that is so great that you can judge this man ? this pig is not annoyed yet

 

223 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: zoro03012002

 

Christ started our church he said "Apon this rock I shall build my church" peter was the "rock" there for peter was the first pope that is even in history books. We feed the poor heal the sick with the money we get there is no one padding their pockets unlike here the preachers on tv. do not dis regard our faith because you do not understand

 

224 Apr-4 From: zoro03012002 To: blushn80

 

I fully understand your beliefs . And Christ was not proposing your church to be the rock it was the knowledge in Peter which recognized who Christ was and who he was sent by . HIS authority is the church of all believers . The Catholic church is man made and not a institute of GOD . In such, it shall in the future cease to exist. ASK for absolving only from the creator GOD and do not kiss the hand of any man or any ring of any man nor confess your sins to anyone but GOD in private with a pure heart. To do so is an abomination in the eyes of GOD.

 

225 Apr-4 From: zoro03012002 To: steph1892

 

This must be written by a child . Seek and ye shall find the truth within yourself not any man or any Pope can absolve you from any condition of your soul. The popes down through the ages have lived in comfort in their palaces of gold and silver while Christ had slept in the fields. The good deeds of the faithful are but the sins of the near ones.

 

226 Apr-4 From: zoro03012002 To: mezzoprano

 

Like the Christ said let the dead bury their dead.

 

227 Apr-4 From: hpjoll To: Dayhawk Kim

 

I believe his role in helping the downfall of the eastern bloc communist regimes will be remembered by the secular world. His devotion to the articles of faith will be remembered by the Church. May he rest in peace.

 

228 From: ALL To: ALL

 

 

 

229 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: asteriscoboricua

 

You #### #### ####. You call yourself a Catholic?? No your just a #### #### #### like the rest of the negative people in here. And to say he doesnt deserve to be in heaven??? Yeah you're real cool. Just post your shit somewhere else and pretend you have something important to say. The pope did more under his reign than any other pope and you better remember that freak......

 

230 Apr-4 From: thinkso13 To: jenn131582

 

You can come try to beat the #### out of me if u want. U can call me an idiot to my face if U want.......I doubt U will succeed. I have killed with my bare hands. I doubt U have done that. My opinion is at least as valid as yours! Bring it on ####! Shut the **** up! U are no christian! I doubt you are even human.

 

231 Apr-4 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

 

 

U don't listen worth a DAMN! I told U to open Your eyes and expand your view! I told U to open your mind and U still are stuck on a local issue. I told U God is the Judge and U still accuse me of judgement! God will judge you and your pope. If a sinner such as me can see your hipocracy and your shortsightedness do U suppose Jesus can see less? Whoopee! Your son has not been molested! Now I get personal because you went there first! You ask what have I done? I have defended this country in a time of war as a volunteer! I have defended your right to shoot off your mouth and talk the selfish nonsense U have tried to bury me in. I have defended your right to worship as you please. I'm not the one U need to convince. I'm not perfect and I'm totally certain you aren't either. You need to work to perfect your church and it's leadership. I work to make fools like you see the path they need to follow. I am not your enemy. Get off your apathy and change your corrupt church! I cannot believe Jesus would approve of the buracracy of the catholic church or any other religeon practiced in his name today! I cannot believe Jesus would approve of the words you have written to me! Your words are still full of excuses I'm sure He would not tolerate. Is the PIG annoyed yet? Before you answer.......ask yourself "What would Jesus say?" I doubt anything I say can convince you of anything. I'm nearly certain I'm wasting my time talking to you. I think U need to send Jesus a copy of your messages and ask for forgivness. Jesus was one man and he changed the world! Your Pope is supposed to be His image on earth. I've seen better representatives of Christ in prison. You have every right to mourn but you have no right to paint John Paul II as not responsable for the deeds of his appointed followers. Did not Jesus rebuke and cast out Judas? We all fall short of the glory of God. That includes you and me and the pope and all the priests and bishops and cardinals you care to name. You and I are here on earth to remind others that we ALL can do better. Now stop telling me how perfect things are and start doing your share to improve things.

 

232 Apr-4 From: jerseystreetbarn To: jenn131582

 

 

 

Dear Jenne

 

after reading all your judemental posts to other people its no wonder people are leaving the " church" in droves. ..

 

if your an example of christian compassion then i really dont know who is the bigger DOPE. you or the POPE!!!!!!..

 

thanks

 

JSB

 

 

 

233 Apr-4 From: jerseystreetbarn To: blushn80

 

 

 

DEar Blush

 

you say. YOU HAVE NO CLUE

 

gee. i guess all those observations on my part were just " made up " huh? thanks for informing me of your wisdsom..

 

ill go play" catholic" now and get back to the great feeling of fear and self loathing. [ the basic of the teachings of the church]...

 

thanks..

 

JSB

 

234 Apr-4 From: jerseystreetbarn To: juleszn

 

 

 

Dear Jule

 

you say. . It's very easy to jump to conclusions though, isn't it?

 

AND to that i say. ITS VERY EASY FOR YOU TO SEE THINGS FOR WHAT YOU WANT THEM TO BE. AND NOT FOR WHAT THEY REALLY ARE. ..

 

I DONT JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS. BUT YOU CERTAINLY SEEM TO LEAP AT THEM

 

THANKS

 

jsb

 

 

 

235 Apr-4 From: jerseystreetbarn To: thinkso13

 

 

 

Dear Thinkso

 

have you discovered the wonders of "SPELL CHECK?? "

 

thanks

 

JSB

 

236 Apr-4 From: Anne To: shawnpnpgh

 

 

 

Too bad you don't believe in following his example. He most certainly would not have addressed me "moron".

 

The very fact that you have to address me that way when you are talking about this topic makes your opinion suspect.

 

237 Apr-4 From: Anne To: jenn131582

 

 

 

All I can say is: "Wow!"

 

I suggest that you do some reading. Take a look at the advice given by any AIDS prevention or activist organization, expecially, to make you sure you are getting accurate information, from one that is prominently run by doctors and nurses.

 

Your opinion is not backed by the recommendations of any of these health organizations.

 

I think I'll go look up exactly how they explain it so that if you should ask me, I can refer you to the data.

 

 

238 Apr-4 From: Anne To: jenn131582

 

 

 

I can see that you like to think what you like to think and don't even have a minimal knowledge of what the Vatican did and did not do re: Cardinal Law.

 

Please don't waste my time unless you can tell me what happened in that instance, and what also took place when the Pope and the Vatican heard about all of the cases worldwide. Or, should I say, what didn't happen.

 

239 Apr-4 From: Anne To: grennma

 

I never said he ignored the homosexual community. Please don't say that I did. Read what I DID say.

 

240 Apr-4 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

You don't know what I have done. More than you probably would guess.

 

As far as the Pope is concerned, my dear, he had the ability to do things that he could have and should have done and did not.

 

Yes, he did great things. If you bothered to read my original message, I acknowledged that fact. Please take the time to read what I wrote in my first sentence.

 

241 Apr-4 From: Anne To: juleszn

 

 

 

First of all, don't go putting words into my mouth. I said he "couldn't stand" the Pope, not that he "hated" them (the last word is yours).

 

The Pope probably respected everyone as he was a person who looked for the good in everyone. But he and Bush did not agree on most issues. Bush never stopped an execution in Texas, nor has he as President. The Pope clearly spoke of execution as part of what he called "the culture of death" and in many cases he personally pleaded with American governors to halt an execution. He said execution was wrong. Bush strongly believes in execution.

 

The Pope told Bush, in so many words, that the invasion of Iraq was morally wrong.

 

Bush was not comfortable with the Pope. See the news reports on their meeting and how that fact is reported in the press.

 

And that's only for starters.

 

242 Apr-4 From: Anne To: jenn131582

 

Would the Pope have wanted you to speak to me in that way? <LOL>

 

243 Apr-4 From: Anne To: jenn131582

 

Sorry to see you so upset.

 

244 Apr-4 From: kramerdjr To: bednarfp

 

 

 

>> Just as the captain of a ship is ultimately responsable for all that happens on board, so is the Pope responsable for the actions of all the clergy. Instead of making excuses for abuse by clergy......<<<

 

bednarfp>He didn't make excuses for them. "The abuse which has caused this crisis is, by every standard, wrong and rightly considered a crime by society; it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God," said the Pope. "The policy is to expel pedophiles from the priesthood and hand them over to civil authorities."<

 

The Pope had a great deal of respect for children, as they did for him. It angered him greatly to think that anyone could abuse them.

 

David

 

 

 

-

 

245 Apr-4 From: sumatoronto To: dman2391

 

newsflash: you're an idiot.

 

just wanted to keep you up to date.

 

246 Apr-4 From: sumatoronto To: blushn80

 

your two thousand year old book promotes many absurd things. you, too, should shut up.

 

247 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

Dont go wasting my time. Cuz it seems to me you dont really know what you are talking about. If you dont like the pope then get out of this forum because this is a forum for people who respect the pope and want to remember him for all the good things he has done in his life.

 

248 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: Anne

 

wow? why dont you go and look at the real data and not the data that health professionals tell you to think..Actually i think a health professional already spoke on this subject in here so maybe you should read it....

 

249 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: thinkso13

 

Oh yeah im not human. I bet you are not even a christian yourself there buddy so just save yourself sometime and shutup. Go kill people or whatever you do cuz if i ever came face to face with you you would see what would happen to you.

 

250 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: steph1892

 

Yeah Steph get em

 

251 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: jerseystreetbarn

 

wow your comment was really smart. My #### isnt judgemental its the truth so why dont you go and state your stupid opinions in a different forum because like i said before this is supposed to be a forum for people who respect the pope and remember all the good he has done and how many lives he has touched throughout the years. I dont really care about Christian compassion right now. Cuz there shouldnt be any for people like you. Apparently you are not a christian.

 

252 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: zoro03012002

 

YOU ARE SO CLUELESS ABOUT OUR FAITH I KNOW CHRIST WAS TALKING ABOUT PETERS KNOWLAGE THAT IS WHY HE WAS OUR FIRST POPE SO THE CATHOLIC CHURCH WAS BUILT ON PETER IT IS IN THE ENCYCLOPEDIA!!!!! I HAVE TOUCHED ON CONFFESSION IN MY OTHER POSTS AS FAR AS KISSING THE POPES RING ARE YOU EVER AWARE THAT THERE IS A PEACE OF THE HOLY CROSS IN THAT RING. I WILL NOT HESSITATE TO KISS IT, BUT AS I SAID YOU HAVE NO CLUE

 

253 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

 

 

You do have a point. I did use the word "hate" instead of saying "couldn't stand". "Couldn't stand" is a phrase that isn't quite as intense as the word "hate". BUT it still "couldn't stand" still implies that there is a great dislike...and perhaps even that is an understatement of what you meant.

 

Anyways, I have seen the Pope and the President interact and speak about one another. I think that it is easy to see that while they share differences on some major issues that you addressed, that they do respect one another. The Pope would not have kept his feelings about the President to himself, because he was always very upfront with everyone. John Paul II was not a man that was known to "beat around a bush"(no pun intended). I've heard him say that he disagreed with Bush and reprimanded him on those topics, but the Pope still knew that Bush was also a child of God and embraced him as a fellow human being. President Bush is the ONLY president to have visited Vatican City 3 times during his presidency. Bush has made public statements long before the Pope's death about how he admires the Pope's integrity and morale strengths. And I've said it before, but I'll say it again: The Pope's and the President's common beliefs and values also helped their relationship. No, they were never the closest of friends, and I'm not claiming that they were. They BOTH respected each other, and I think that's all we could've asked for. At least, that was good enough for me.

 

254 Apr-4 From: jerseystreetbarn To: jenn131582

 

 

 

Dear Jenn

 

you say "wow your comment was really smart"

 

thank you . it was well thought out, as its recollections from the past history that has been posted.

 

glad you appreciate it for its truthfulness

 

Apparently you are not a christian\\

 

im a " recovering catholic" . [ they are not as hateful and judgmental as todays Christians. ] just a little more " guilt ridden"

 

thanks

 

JSB

 

255 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: steph1892

 

I'm going to assume that you didn't mean to make the asinine mistake of yelling at someone who actually AGREES with you. Read a bit slower before you type.

 

256 Apr-4 From: brooklynbud69 To: jenn131582

 

 

 

Maybe you should learn to read ~ the Pope and his council deliberated for years as to how to handle the situation and covered up case after case. Because of the Vatican's inaction, many people were affected and many left the Church in outrage. Article after article substantiates this.

 

For the record, I do not worship the devil. I'm a lifelong Catholic who is concerned for the Church and what it stands for. The direction from the Vatican must be more tolerant and less judgemental, if the Church ~ at least in the U.S. and Europe ~ is going to survive. Pope John Paul did do some remarkable work Internationally with the fall of Communism and being an Embassador of Good Will for many impoverished countries, however he did not take the Church foward ~ he took it back to Vatican I. For this, this institution may never come out of the middle ages.

 

No, I'm not the devil. Maybe you should check to see if you might need an excorcism.

 

257 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

YOU ACUSE ME OF NOT LISTINING THE POPE DID NOT APPOINT THE PRIESTS THE BISHOPS DID SO YES BECAUSE THERE ARE MORE OF THEM AND ONE OF HIM. HE GAVE HIS ORDERS TO THE BISHOPS ON WHAT TO DO BECAUSE THE BISHOPS ARE HERE THEY ARE MORE FIT TO GET RID IF THESE CRIMINALS. THANK YOU FOR DEFENDING MY RIGHTS ALONG WITH 1/2 MY FAIMILY I DO NOT DENY THAT YOU DO GOOD HOWEVER YOU DID NOT BRING IT ALL TOGETHER SINGLE HANDEDLY AS THE POPE DID ALL I AM ASKING IS A LITTLE RESPECT FOR A MAN WHO DID MORE IN A YEAR THAN MOST DO IN A LIFE TIME. I DON'T EXPECT TO CHANGE YOUR VIEW JUST TRYING TO SHARE MINE I'D HATE TO SEE WHAT YOU'D SAY OF MOTHER TERESA. AND NO THE PIG IS STILL NOT ANNOYED...

 

258 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: jerseystreetbarn

 

YOU CAN QUOTE STATS ALL YOU WANT UNTIL YOU ARE THERE IT IS EASY TO SAY TALK TO ME WHEN YOU ARE WITHOUT FOOD WITHOUT HEAT IN DEAD OF WINTER. THE CHURCH SAVED MY FAMILY .MY GRAND PARENTS WERE MISSIONARIES WHO FEED THE POOR HELP THEM WITH THEIR BASIC NEEDS THESE PEOPLE ARE GREATFUL FOR WHAT THEY HAVE UNLIKKE HERE WHERE WE MOAN AND COMPLAIN THOSE PEOPLE ARE MUCH MORE BLESSED BECAUSE OF THEIR CHALLENGES. MY GRANDMOTHER DIED DOING THIS WORK IN 97 SHE WAS HAPPY THAT THE CHURCH ALLOWED HER TO GIVE SOMUCH OF HERSELF FOR A GREATER GOOD. GO ON AND PREACH WHAT YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND WE ARE TAUGHT TO BE BETTER THAN WE ARE TO BE SELFLESS NOT TO GIVE IN TO WORLDLY THINGS THIS IS NOT SLEF LOATHING

 

259 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

I APPRECIATE YOUR AKNOWLAGEMENT. HOWEVER IT IS UNREALTO EXPECT SO MUCH OF ONE MAN WHEN WE AS CATHOLICS ARE UNITY WE ARE TO BLAME FOR THE CHURCHS FAILINGS NOT HIM. HE DID MORE IN 1 YEAR THAN MOST DO IN THEIR LIFE. NO ONE EXPECTS AS MUCH FROM ANY OTHER LEADER, I 'D BE THRILLED IF 1 GOT CLOSE TOWHAT OUR POPE OR MOTHER TERESA HAD DONE. I THANK YOU FOR BEING RESONABLE IN YOUR SPEAKING,ULIKE SOME I HAVE DELT WITH. I JUST HOPE TO GIVE YOU SOMETHING TO THINK ON

 

260 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: sumatoronto

 

TELLING SOMEONE TO SHUT UP BECAUSE YOU HAVE NO REBUTLE IS ABSURD I'D PUT THAT 2000 YR OLD BOOK UP AGAINST ANY DOCUMENT YOU MAY PUT AGAINST IT

 

261 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

 

 

HERE IS SOME DATA THAT IS BACKED BY ALL THE #1 PREVENTATIVE OF AIDS IS ONE THE CHURCH PRIDES IT'S SELF ON THE SAFEST SEX IS NO SEX. IT CAN BE DONE, IF THIS HAD BEEN DONE AIDS MAY NOT HAVE GOTTEN AS OUT OF CONTROL, JUST MORE TO THINK ON...

 

262 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

AS FAR AS THE GAY COMMUNITY GOES WE MUST ABIDE BY THE BIBLE YOU CAN'T TAKE WHAT YOU WANT AND THROW THE REST AWAY AND IT IS CLEAR THE STANDS ON IT IN THE BIBLE. HOWEVER HE TOLD US TO LOVE ALL. YOU DON'T HAVE TO LOVE EVERYTHING ABOUT SOMEONE TO LOVE THEM IT WOULD BE UNREAL TO:)

 

263 Apr-4 From: Anne To: juleszn

 

 

 

Well, then I hope that some of my respondents will respect me for saying how I feel, too, and not try to censure me for speaking my feelings about the Pope's legacy.

 

It's amazing to read some of the vile personal comments that have been directed to me for having my opinion about this Pope.

 

The very ones who praise him for wanting world peace!

 

264 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

I have no problem respecting you and your opinions as long as you're not just attacking the Pope's character for the sake of attacking him. You have to understand that while these times aren't any different for you since the Pope has died, that his death has greatly affected those who loved him. Just like remembering any loved one, people like to remember the good that they brought. I don't think people are just so naive though to believe that their loved ones had faults too. In a time of mourning though, it would be inappropriate to attack their character. I understand where you're coming from, but I hope you can understand where I'm coming from as well. Thanks.

 

265 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

And just so you know, while I don't condone the personal attacks on you, I understand where their anger comes from. It's pretty easy to lash out at someone when you or someone you love is being criticized. I'm guilty of that too(especially when someone makes a truly tactless remark), but I try my damnedest to represent what I believe in a fairly mature manner. It's also typically a lot easier to understand someone who addresses a situation in a reasonable manner, rather than letting their emotions go wild.

 

266 Apr-4 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

Throughout the Bible, there is mention of slaves. Never once does the Bible condemn slaves. How do you feel about that? Should not the Bible have said, "Slavery is evil?" It didn't.

 

You cannot take the Bible literally. The Church itself does not teach a literal interpretation of the Bible. I hope that you realize that fact.

 

So, if you say that a gay relationship is considered evi l by the Church or the Pope, you have to understand that these teachings are the interpretation of the Church.

 

I am not saying the above simply due to my own opinion. Theologians the world over - Catholic theologians - have disagreed strongly with the Pope's condemnation of homosexual behavior. Sure, not all of them, but many.

 

Have you ever studied theology in a Catholic institution? I have, and in fact, I have taken not only the required study in my Catholic college, but many electives as well. You would find that there is a great debate that goes on in the Church on many of the teachings of the Church.

 

The Pope's stance on homosexuality is not considered a doctrine of the Church. It is a teaching of the current Church, less rigidly set than the basic doctrines such as the virgin birth, the Ascension, etc.

 

I don't know how much real education you have had in matters of Church doctrine and theology, but if you don't have much of a background, you may only be listening to hearsay, not actual current theology.

 

 

267 Apr-4 From: Anne To: juleszn

 

 

 

Well, at least your message is a bit more respectful and toned down than what I have gotten from some before.

 

I am deeply disturbed, to say the least, at how the Pope never got enough involved in the scandals of the pedophile priests.

 

You know the incident in the New Testament when Jesus threw the money changers out the the temple, in anger? Jesus made a real scene, did he not?

 

Why didn't the Pope do more than give one single solitary speech to the world about these priests? Why didn't he take a fit over the sexual abuse of thousands of chidren at the hands of priests? To me, THAT was one of his most important jobs! And then he appointed the coddler of some of these priests, Cardinal Law, (my former Cardinal, as a matter of fact, in Boston), as Bishop of a basilica in the Vatican City. Are you aware of that fact?

 

There is more, but I won't go on.

 

 

268 Apr-4 From: Anne To: juleszn

 

 

 

Well, maybe these same people could stop and consider where my anger comes from, at the way the Church (and this Pope) have handled a number of awfully important issues.

 

If you take a look at my original message, I never lashed out at anyone, nevertheless. I just said the unpopular thing.

 

He was supposed to be a moral leader. Well, he should have lead differently on many moral issues of great importance.

 

Listen, he was not your personal buddy. He was the Pope. People usually only got to know him via the TV, radio and newspapers. I think that readers here can somehow take my remarks a lot better than they want to admit. They just don't want cherished beliefs questioned, that's all.

 

 

269 Apr-4 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

I grew up in the Catholic church decades before this Pope was even a Cardinal. I grew up before Vatican ll, in fact.

 

The Church has, for the past 100 years in particular, championed the human rights of the poor. It is that part of my Catholic upbringing for which I am probably most grateful. I was taught to have a social conscience by the Church.

 

In this area, I respected the Pope so very much. He

truly cared about the suffering of the poor.

 

He really messed up with the wonderful priests and nuns who were practicing liberation theology, however, in Nicaragua. Who knows, he may have saved thousands from murder and great poverty and suffering had he not been so ill informed. (Not ill intentioned. Just ill informed.)

 

It is a tragedy.

 

270 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

 

 

Yes, I do agree...the Pope SHOULD have made a larger public statement about the criminals in our Church. I did remember hearing about how the Pope felt about the situation indirectly from a news source, but didn't see him talk himself. I know though, that the Pope never ever condoned what happened and was furious. The Pope, in his frail state, was heartbroken. Arguing about what should have been done will do us no good. We can only learn from the past and move on to do it better. There was a priest from my area(that I knew, but not well)that was convicted of child abuse and is now paying for that crime in jail.

 

Those accused have worsened our reputation that has already been tarnished enough. It is important for the public to know that the Catholic people...at least the ones that I know, are very disgusted and furious with these priests. But it is also important to consider those priests who are truly good men. I have two parish priests at my church who are honest, hardworking men with hearts in the right place. They don't try to pretend that they are holier than thou...in fact, one of them stated in one of his homilies that, "I am not more important than you just because I wear the garb. You and I, the people, ARE the Church. The simple fact is that neither of us can exist without the other. We are here to serve each other." I find that I look up to them more because they are so humble and real.

 

Despite what some may think of us, we're not corporate monsters attempting to take over the world. Most of us are just trying to practice our faith and be good people. Sure, we fall along the way, but so do those of every religion in the world. And personally, I think the Pope did a better job of trying than I have...but I'm still working at it.

 

271 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

 

 

YOU MAY HAVE A POINT I DIDNT GO TO A TO SCHOOL FOR RELIGION, HOWEVER BEFORE I WAS CNFIRMED AS A CATHOLIC I RESEARCHED MANY OTHER FAITHS BUT THIS WAS HOME TELL ME HOW TO TAKE "NO DRUNKERDS NOR HOMOSEXUALS SHALL ENTER THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN"?????

 

I NEVER DAMNED THEM TO HELL BUT THERE IS A PLACE TO ATONE YOUR WRONGS

 

NO I DID NOT JUST BELIEVE BECAUSE I WAS TOLD TO YOU MUST LEARN OF ALL THAT THE CHURCH TEACHES BEFORE YOU CAN TRUELY BE ONE (AS YOU WELL KNOW)

 

272 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: Anne

 

 

 

I know that the Pope wasn't my buddy. I didn't have the opportunity to go out and have a drink with him or take him out to a party like I do with my friends, but I still considered him the earthly father of my religious family. And of course I've questioned my religion, as I'm sure I will be for the rest of my life. I mean, I think any healthy person would. But just because you don't believe in exactly everything that you're told to believe in, doesn't mean you're not a part of it. I've disagreed plenty of times with things in my religion, even stuff concerning the Sacraments. In fact, I'm not too fond of my archbishop, but that's another long and boring story. But none of the problems with my religion make me want to abandon Catholicism. The good aspects of the Church are what keep me interested...and probably always will.

 

I did get to meet him by the way, when he made his visit to St. Louis. You're right...it does make a huge difference to meet him in person. I wish you could've experienced it. The meeting was truly indescribable.

 

273 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

 

 

YEAH LIKE HE NEEDED TO MAKE A SCENE DON'T YOU THINK THAT IF HE HAD THAT THOSE WHO ALREADY THINK CATHOLICS ARE WHACK JOBS WOULD REACT?

 

BESIDES THE AMERINCAN CATHOLIC CHURCH IS SO MESSED UP. WHY IS IT SO BAD HERE? IT IS UP TO THE BISHOPS HERE AND OUR COMMUNITY HERE TO GET THESE NASTY VILE MEN FROM OUR CHURCHES JUST AS WE DON'T EXPECT BUSH TO DEAL WITH THE SCOUT LEADERS DOING THE SAME CRIMES. WE EXPECT OUR PROSICUTERS AND JUDGES TO LOCK THEM UP.OUR FAITH MEANS UNITY SO WE MUST UNITE AND SEE THESE "MEN" ARE PUNISHED

 

274 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: juleszn

 

VERY WELL PUT

 

275 Apr-4 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

YEAH LIKE HE NEEDED TO MAKE A SCENE DON'T YOU THINK THAT IF HE HAD THAT THOSE WHO ALREADY THINK CATHOLICS ARE WHACK JOBS WOULD REACT?

>>

 

Making a scene is NOT acting like a whack job. It is showing that you are very upset about something awful that has happened on your watch.

 

I will add that he was so old and frail by then, come to think of it. He was not up to it, I suppose. But, it nobody really dealt with it in the Vatican. Nice, eh?

 

276 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

i agree but like i said it is up to all catholics to protect our kids we must make scenes. unfortunately many turned their backs on our faith and the abused

 

277 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: juleszn

 

YOU AGREE WITH ME!SORRY,I'VE BEEN UPSET LATLY.

 

278 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: jenn131582

 

THANKS JENN

 

279 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: jenn131582

 

GO GETEM jenn

 

280 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

listen you **** ***.you cant even fight.im 13 and i fight lots of people.13,14,15,16,17,18,and so on.i can even beatup a 48 year old you cant.

you wan fight.bring it on ********.

 

281 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: zoro03012002

 

what the hell are you saying.im 13 years old.im a teenager not a child

 

282 Apr-4 From: bednarfp To: kramerdjr

 

"The abuse which has caused this crisis is, by every standard, wrong and rightly considered a crime by society; it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God," said the Pope. "The policy is to expel pedophiles from the priesthood and hand them over to civil authorities."<

 

>The Pope had a great deal of respect for children, as they did for him. It angered him greatly to think that anyone could abuse them. David<<

 

The Pope was absolutely right to condemn the abusers and expel them from the clergy. You're right, Pope John Paul II did have a great deal of respect for children. He was truly a great Pope, and an exceptional man, who accomplished so very much in his lifetime. The right man at the right time, to help free Eastern Europe from the grip of the Soviet Union. He was a modern day hero.

 

Fred

 

.

[Jeb]

283 From: ALL To: ALL

 

 

 

284 Apr-4 From: jenn131582 To: brooklynbud69

 

no i really dont think i need an exorcism. If you really are a catholic maybe you should act like it instead of being against other catholics.

 

285 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: steph1892

 

It's okay steph1892. I was just taken by surprise that's all. I apologize also if I sounded a bit snippy. This is a sad time for many people(including myself), so I understand.

 

286 Apr-4 From: juleszn To: bednarfp

 

Yay Fred!

 

287 Apr-4 From: mayrialedetsr09 To: mayrialedetsr09

 

I didn't really know the pope either but i have heard of his accomplishments and i hear from the news and other sources that he have lived to achieve his accomplishments long enough..... i hope the pope rest in peace and i know he will meet his maker in heaven

 

288 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: juleszn

 

that you understanding.im 13.maybe we could chat sometime on the internet.her is my e-mail

steph1892@cs.com.write back

 

289 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: jenn131582

 

oh jenn if you want to chat sometime.here is my e-mail.

steph1892@cs.com

 

290 Apr-4 From: steph1892 To: bednarfp

 

shut up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

291 Apr-4 From: leethev To: steph1892

 

Of course, he sucked as a pope....for SEVERAL years now, he has had NO power or influence, just a bunch of lod dead talk.....His pencil hasn't had lead in it for years....He was simply A figure -head for ploitical staleness...He sat back and watched the church cover up case after case of molestations from corrupt "men of God"....The pope is dead...Thank God.....

 

292 Apr-4 From: blushn80 To: leethev

 

WHAT WOULD YOU PEOPLE HAVE HIM DO IN HIS STATE??? OVER HERE IT WAS OUR RESPONSABILITY AS THE CATHOLIC COMMUNITY TO PROTECT OUR CHILDREN. IT WAS OUR BISHOPS JOB TO SEND THESE "MEN" TO THE ATHORITIES THE POPE HAS MORE TO GOVERN OVER THE OUR BUSH DOES AND YET WE DO NOT EXPECT BUSH TO SEND SCOUT LEADERS WHO DO THE SAME CRIMES TO JAIL THAT IS THE JOB OF OUR LOCAL PROSICUTERS AND JUDGES. OUR BISHOPS MUST DO MORE FOR THE ABUSED SINCE THEY ARE WHO ORDAINED THESE PRIESTS. THESE CRIMES MUST NOT GO UNPUNISHED. HOWEVER WE MUST REMEMBER NOT ALL PRIESTS ARE SICK. THERE ARE MANY GOOD ONE WHO ARE UNFAIRLY TYPE CAST

 

293 Apr-5 From: jenn131582 To: blushn80

 

thank you blushn80. Im glad someone understands something in here

 

294 Apr-5 From: mynnahbirds To: thatshot427

 

I am not of the cathoic religion, However I think I do recognize a greeat and decent man. The world is apoorer place without him and I pray to thank god for a good soul.

 

295 Apr-5 From: leethev To: jenn131582

 

Understand THIS !!!! The pope was a veg for the last 5 yrs and accomplished NOTHING to further the Catholic church....He was a sickly old man who was a n ineffectual puppet...Yes, there was a time when he had the physical ability to carry out his mission to itz full extent..Those yrs. were a long time ago......Open your eyes for Christ sake....His replacement will truelly be a man of power and youth to carry through.......Get a grip people.....

 

296 Apr-5 From: bednarfp To: leethev

 

 

 

Understand THIS !!!! The pope was a veg for the last 5 yrs and accomplished NOTHING to further the Catholic church....He was a sickly old man who was a n ineffectual puppet...Yes, there was a time when he had the physical ability to carry out his mission to itz full extent..Those yrs. were a long time ago......<<

 

It's true, Pope John Paul II was gravely ill for the last five years, yet in his lifetime he accomplished a lot more than any other Pope ever did. I give him a lot of credit for helping to free Eastern Europe. It was a life well lived.

 

Fred

 

.

 

 

 

297 Apr-5 From: brooklynbud69 To: jenn131582

 

 

 

No, I'm not against other Catholics. But I am against reverting our Church back to the middle-ages. We are in the 21st Century now, and the Church, like any other institution must update to be more inclusive of our 21st Century world.

 

You obviously don't agree, so why don't we just say "we agree to disagree" and leave it at that. You like the way the Church is currently, I would like to see improvements ~ ie. the way women are viewed in the heirarchy of the church, priests being able to marry, the use of birthcontrol and stem cell research. I believe I said in my last reply that I do agree with you that the Pontiff has done a lot of good in the International community ~ dealing with the fall of Communism, healing the rift between the Church and Israel, etc. But I most certainly stand by the fact that this Pope and his council turned a blind eye to the pedophilia scandals world wide, while innocent children were being scared for life ~ both girls AND boys. The secrecy and the old laws to protect the priests from secular law was wrong then and it is wrong now.

 

I know many people who have left the Church. I know many more that are in agreement with me. Are you Catholic? Maybe you should take a deeper look at the Church around you to see what could be improved. Maintaining the status quo is dangerous to any organization. The Bible tells us many things, but it also says that tolerance is a virtue. Christ was tolerant, so I believe that the Pontiff should be too. John Paul was very intolerant about many things and unfortunately, many people left while he was the head of the Church. I hope that the next Pope will be more aware that the memberships of parishes all over the world have dwindled and that we really need to take a look at why this has happened.

 

That's all. Good luck to you.

 

298 Apr-5 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

IT IS UP TO THE BISHOPS HERE AND OUR COMMUNITY HERE TO GET THESE NASTY VILE MEN FROM OUR CHURCHES JUST AS WE DON'T EXPECT BUSH TO DEAL WITH THE SCOUT LEADERS DOING THE SAME CRIMES. WE EXPECT OUR PROSICUTERS AND JUDGES TO LOCK THEM UP.OUR FAITH MEANS UNITY SO WE MUST UNITE AND SEE THESE "MEN" ARE PUNISHED

>>

 

Now you are so defensive of the Pope that you can't even take a look at what REALLY happened with the Bishops and Cardinals in the US, and how the Pope never once, not one single solitary time, corrected their decisions to keep secret the crimes of priests preying on children and others.

 

In fact, my dear, he not only overlooked these actions but he PROTECTED Cardinal Law of Boston after he was pretty much run out of Boston for protecting, for years and for mutliple, clearly reported offenses, Geoghan, the priest and Paul Shanley, his other John priest. Between forced testimony to Boston prosecutors (Oh, he fought having to give testimony and fought, unsuccessfully, the successful subpoenas, by the judge, of private records containing letters and complaints from parents, nuns and other priests, even, about child molesting priests!! And guess where he ran off to, in between these stressful meetings?? Guess where? Off to Rome, to PRIVATE meetings with John Paul ll, where he was received warmly and with sympathy for his 'troubles'. When the heat got too bad, when all of Boston was demanding that he step down as Cardinal, he was taken back by the Pope and given his present job.

 

It's all there, well documented in The Boston Globe. In fact, they did a special series on it.

 

Now Cardinal Law enjoys the security and comfort as Bishop of a basilica in the Vatican City!!

 

I suggest that you open your mind to a few other ideas other than that which is currently propogated by the media, as they all suck up to the John Paul ll's papal reign. Take a look at one of the more sophisticated writers of Catholic history, see his op-ed piece (you can Google it any time you want),in the April 5 2005 New York Times entitled " The Price of Infallibility", and learn a bit about the history of the Papacy and the Church from a well regarded historian, Thomas Cahill (author of "How the Irish Saved Civilizaton").

 

 

299 Apr-5 From: blushn80 To: Anne

 

 

 

I AM NOT SURE HOW TO RESPOND BECAUSE i NEVER READ ABOUT BOSTON CARDNAL, I HOWEVER CAN ONLY SPEAK ON WHAT IS IN MY OWN COMMUNITY OF KC. HERE IT SEEMS THAT ANY PRIEST THAT DIDN'T GUARD HISELF AS MY PRIEST HAD IS BEING ACUSED (NOT THAT THERE AREN'T CRIMINALS AMONG THEM.) I BELIEVE THAT THE CATHLOIC COMMUNITY HAS SOME BLAME AS I SAID HE IS ONE MAN WE ARE MANY. I HAVE LEARNED TO BE GUARDED IN THIS ISSUE... THE HARD WAY. (AND NOT FROM CLERGY) LOOKING BACK THERE ARE MANY SIGNS OF A MOLESTER WE JUST HAVE TO BE OPEN TO THEM....

 

IF YOU SUSPECT AS SUCH AND IFNOTHING IS DONE YOU MOVE TO ANOTHER CHURCH. A PRIEST CAN'T SERVE AN EMPTY CHURCH!!!

 

I STILL CANNOT SEE WHY IT IS SO CRAZY HERE....NO WHERE ELSE IS IT THIS BAD! WHY DO WE CONTINUE TURNING THIS KIND OF PRIEST? OR IS IT NOT HAPPENING AS MUCH AS WE THINK? BUT STIL THESE ARE OUR PROBLEMS NOT A MAN WHO GAVE HIS LIFE TO THE WORLD, BESIDES WHO KNOWS WHAT HE'D HAVE DONE HAD HE BEEN YOUGER OR STRONGER

 

300 Apr-5 From: blushn80 To: leethev

 

DO NOT PUT THIS MAN DOWN HE DID MORE IN ONE YEAR THEN MOST DUE IN A LIFETIME (INCLUDING YOU) I'D HATE TO SEE WHAT YOU'D DO TO AN ELDERLY MEMBER OF YOUR FAMILY WHEN THEY CAN'T MEET YOUR EXPECTATIONS. HE DID MORE FOR THE WORLD THAN THE MAJORITY OF OTHER WORLD LEADERS.

 

301 Apr-5 From: blushn80 To: brooklynbud69

 

FIRST THIS IS NOT AN INSTATUTION. I WILL NOT ARGUE WITH MANY OF YOUR POINTS EXEPT 2 1 WOMEN ARE NOT TREATED AS LESS THAN MEN WE JUST HAVE DIFFERENT PLACES. JUST AS WE DO IN A FAMILY UNIT I AM NO LESS THAN MY HUSBAND WORKS OUTSIDE OUR HOME AND HE IS NO LESS BECAUSE I CARE FOR OUR DAUGHTER. WHY INCOURAGE KILLING INOCENT BABIES? DO YOU KNOW THAT A WOMAN CAN SELL HER "FEATUS" TO SCIENCE? NO LIFE IS WORTH MY ABILITY TO WALK AND YES STEM CELLS MAY HELP MY ABILITY BUT IT'S NOT WORTH IT. CELL RESEARCH SHOULD BE RESTRICTED TO AFTER BIRTH... THAT IS FITTING A NEW LIFE ENHANCING ANOTHER.

 

302 Apr-5 From: juleszn To: leethev

 

 

 

Wow....at least other people who have had negative things to say about the Pope did it in a tactful and reasonable manner. For all of his faults, he never would have said "Thank God" about someone who had passed away. I think that's an insensitive and heartless thing to say about anyone.

 

And I think that unless you are a person without any vices(sins, faults, flaws, etc.) yourself, you have no right to say such things about another person, let alone someone who has MOST PROBABLY done more good in his life than many of us will ever do, including yourself.

 

I have wondered about what people will say about me when I pass. I've done quite a bit in my life that I'm not proud of, but I certainly hope that the good that I have done in my life best exemplifies who I am. I hope that you'll take the time to examine your own life, because maybe then, you'll actually think before you say something so hateful again.

 

303 Apr-5 From: Anne To: blushn80

 

 

 

If you never heard about the incidents with Cardinal Law in Boston, well, I am kind of surprised because that is the issue that kicked off the nationwide awareness of these priests.

 

It truly amazes me that it doesn't seem to bother you how the Pope protected him. This is remarkable.

 

304 Apr-5 From: steph1892 To: leethev

 

listen here you jerk.the pope was a great man he accomplishmany things.i will not let you talk bad about him like that so shut up or else.

 

305 Apr-5 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

how dear you.john paul is not in hell he is in heaven with god.god want john to be there with him.so shut up.

 

306 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: steph1892

 

 

 

Steph; You have every right to believe your dead pope is in heaven. Just as I have the right to believe he went to hell for knowing about child abuse and allowing it to continue. What you have no right to do is tell me to shut up. Since no mortal can know the mind of God both opinions are equally valid. The first ammendment of the U.S Constitution gives all of us the right to speak. Kindly remember that when you post here!

 

307 Apr-6 From: shawnpnpgh To: Anne

 

I guess ur a born again ass let me ask you sommthing what did you do to be come born again did you shoot kill or rape cause you people make me sick just cause your so called born again give me a break practice what you preach. and dont get smart cause i bet i make alot more money than you do another thing dont get smart with some one that works for the news cause i can tell you facts that will make you feel like a retard. have a nice day:)

 

308 Apr-6 From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

 

<You have every right to believe your dead pope is in heaven. Just as I have the right to believe he went to hell for knowing about child abuse and allowing it to continue.<

 

Have you seen the movie "Defending Your Life", starring Albert Brooks? I'd like the job defending the Pope. He didn't abuse any children and he condemned those who did:

 

"The abuse which has caused this crisis is, by every standard, wrong and rightly considered a crime by society: it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God," said the Pope. "The policy is to expel pedophiles from the priesthood and hand them over to civil authorities."

 

Considering all of the good works that he accomplished in his lifetime, I'm sure that Pope John Paul II 's soul sits very high in Heaven right near God.

 

Fred

 

.

 

309 Apr-6 From: bednarfp To: shawnpnpgh

 

 

 

>I guess ur a born again ass let me ask you sommthing .... i bet i make alot more money than you do another thing dont get smart with some one that works for the news cause i can tell you facts that will make you feel like a retard. have a nice day:)<

 

Learning to spell would sure help a lot in your profession.

 

Fred

 

 

 

 

 

310 Apr-6 From: arabiansanchez To: life4teri

 

I disagree with much of the Pope's stances. I'm hardly religous, what with being a Catholic and a gay man, but I do accept he was a force for good and done many great things. I hope a younger Pope is appointed who'll take a more modern view on many issues I feel Pope John Paul II was perhaps a little old-fashioned in addressing- Equality and acceptance of homosexuals being my main wish; I feel J.P II showed his age in calling my sexuality sinful and opened the way for widespread intolerance to continue.

 

Bout time the old fella had a rest though! His dignity through his long suffering is a symbol of strength for all religous practioners.

 

311 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: bednarfp

 

I've heard that quote........I also know that he stated that policy only after many of the children abused by the clergy had grown to be adults. And after many abusers had been promoted to positions of higher authority within the church. To use an old navy term much abuse happened on his watch. I can't believe he was ignorant of it. Since he was the man in charge that makes him responsable for it. As I have said once before in this forum......One sin cancels thousands of good works. I suppose John Paul to be not guilty in the same way as O.J.

 

312 Apr-6 From: arabiansanchez To: thinkso13

 

You have a point but the extremity of it makes it a pretty poor one. Are you suggesting the pope condoned or didn't care about molestation ? Absurd.

 

313 Apr-6 From: roncastelo To: Dayhawk Kim

 

Pope John Paul II brought the church back to Its world position. He certainly changed the course of history by engaging in the world affairs for the betterment of the humankind. Pope John Paul The Great!

 

314 Apr-6 From: juleszn To: arabiansanchez

 

 

 

I have to say that I appreciate and completely respect your comments about the Pope. I also agree with what you said about gay rights within the Church. Even though I am heterosexual, I have no problems at all with the homosexual community. As far as I'm concerned, you are no more a sinner than I. I also hope and pray for more acceptance within the Church, because that would be the best solution for our future growth and health as a religious community. I admire you for your courage to speak out against some of the Church's teachings, while still acknowledging ultimately the good person that the Pope was. Please know that you are not alone with your beliefs. There are plenty of your fellow hetero-Catholics who support you. Please take care!

 

315 Apr-6 From: arabiansanchez To: juleszn

 

Much appreciated Sir. Shame I, and others, don't come across many people as comfortable, logical or straight forward on the 'gay issue' as yourself. God bless.

 

316 Apr-6 From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

 

>To use an old navy term much abuse happened on his watch. I can't believe he was ignorant of it.<

 

How aware do you think Chester Nimitz was of what went on aboard each ship in the Fleet? Not very much. Even the skipper of my DD was lucky to know the names of each of the crew, much less what they did on a personal level.

 

Fred

 

.

 

317 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: juleszn

 

well put ( :

 

318 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

it does no good the try to talk to thinkso13. because when you make a point that he/she has no rebutle to you get ignored

 

319 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

THIS IS REGARDS TO YOUR LAS NOTE....WHILE THERE IS FREE SPEACH . WE ARE ALL IN MOURNING. I HOPE THAT YOU WOULD NOT GO TO THE FUNERAL OR A WAKE OF SOMEONE YOU DIDN'T LIKE TO DISREGARD THEIR ACOMPLISHMENTS AND BELITTLE THEIR CHARACTER.....I DON'T BELIEVE YOU COULD BE THAT CRUEL. WETHER YOU LIKED HIM OR NOT OUR LEADER IS DEAD. MOST OF US ARE IN MOURNING AND THIS IS OUR ONLY WAY TO SHARE OUR RESPECTS "KINDLY REMEMBER" THAT!

 

320 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: arabiansanchez

 

FIRST THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPECT, IT DOES MEAN SOMETHING...AS FAR AS HIS VIEW OF YOUR LIFE STYLE... HE WAS JUST FOLLOWING THE TEACHINGS OF THE BIBLE, IT IS IN THERE. HOWEVER HE TAUGHT US THAT NONE OF US ARE WITHOUT SIN SO WE MUST LOVE ALL. WE MUST LOOK PAST ALL OUR FAULTS AND EXCEPT EACHOTHER AS CHILDREN OF GOD. HE PUT US ALL HERE FOR A REASON. WE MUST FOLLOW THE LORDS TEACHINGS AND THEY DON'T CHANGE THE WAY OUR WORLD DOES. THOSE OF US WHO ARE TRUE FOLLOWERS OF OUR POPE LOVE AND RESPECT YOU, PLEASE REMEMBER THAT

 

321 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: bednarfp

 

 

 

Well, Fred;

 

I'd say Admiral Nimitz knew where all of his ships were. I'd say he knew the exact state of readiness of each command. I'd even go as far as to say he knew which crews were screw-ups and which were heroes. Perhaps the skipper of my CLG was superior to your DD skipper. Capt Adamson made it a point to know the 1,000 men in his command. I had the opportunity to work very closely with him myself as his phone talker during a Med deployment.

 

To return to Pope John Paul......I simply disagree that he was as great as all the press he is getting. To me as a protestant, he was just an overworked leader of a dying church who made a very large mistake in not handling the child abuse scandal before it did major damage to the credibility of the entire Catholic church.

 

I really appreciate the way you discuss this subject. If you have read this entire thread you know some responses to my posts have been less than intelligent or polite. Yes, I have responded in kind to a couple of them but I do try not to lose my cool most of the time. Thanks for listening!

 

322 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

This is not your parish hall. This is a public forum. I would never come to your church and speak what I have said here. I don't visit churchyards and tip over headstones. If you expect to mourn with those who share all your opinions go to your church. If you choose to express opinions in public places you should expect disagreement. You have many other ways to share your respects for your dead leader. I'ts not my fault you chose this one.

 

323 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

look dude pope was a great man he made peace in the world.he didn't do bad things in the world.so he deserves to be in heavon.

 

324 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

what the heck does rebutle mean.

 

325 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: steph1892

 

This "dude" totally disagrees with you. Tell me where in the world there is peace? Africa is full of civil war and ethnic cleansing. Moslems and Jews have continously been killing each other for 2,000 years. The North Koreans are developing nukes and threatening the rest of us with them. The Chinese are threatening to invade Tiawan. Terrorists are blowing up embassies and trains, even office buildings and nightclubs worldwide! Major divisions exist even within the Catholic church. Is there unity there on the subject of birth control? NO! Does the church speak with one voice on the subject of homosexuality? NO! Is there equality for women within the Catholic faith? I've never heard of a lady priest. Priests have abused thousands of innocent children. God will decide how great John Paul really was. I have informed Him of my opinion. If you haven't guessed by now it is somewhat different than yours.

 

326 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

THIS MAYBE A PUBLIC FORUM BUT THIS BRANCH WAS FOR HIS ACCOMPLISHMENTS NOT TO BASH OUR FAITH YOU COULD CREATE A FORUM FOR HIS FLAWS AND ANY OF US WOULD BE OUT OF PLACE. YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO YOUR THOUGHTS I HAVE TALKED WITH ANNE QUITE A LOT WE DO NOT AGREE ON MUCH BUT SHE DOES NOT DISRESPECT MY BELIEFS SHE SIMPLY EXPLAINS HER VIEW WITHOUT DEGRADING ANYONE. OUR POPE IS DEAD AND YOU DISREGARD US FOR NOT THINKING YOUR WAY. LASTLY I READ YOUR CLAIM OF BEING A CHRISTIAN ( I FORGET WHICH BRANCH) TO MY KNOWLAGE ALLCHRISTIAN FAITHS BELIEVE THAT WE ARE NOT TO JUDGE SO HOW CAN YOU SAY HE HIS IN HELL??? WE ARE TO PRAY FOR MERCY FOR ALL. I DO NOT DIS REGARD YOUR OPINION, BUT DON'T APPRIECIATE YOUR MANNER. YOU MADE IT CLEAR YOU DISLIKE THE POPE AND WE'RE ALL IDIOTS FOR TRYING TO PAY OUR RESPECTS AMONGST EACH OTHER. THERE ARE FAR BETTER WAYS TO GET YOU POINT ACROSS THE HOLIER THAN THOU ISN'T WORKING FOR YOU.

 

327 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

listen here mister no it all.there is peace on the other side of earth.what about chine,japan,coreu,asia,africa,euope,etc.there is lots of peace you just don't see it.

i don't go to church.i'm 13.i have perpresher.does church tellyou when you can have sex.No!

do they say when you can get marreid.NO!WE DON'T NOW WHERE JOHN PAUL WILL GO.GOD NOWS WHERE JOHN PAUL IS GOING.

 

328 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

IT'S A COME BACK YOU MIGHT AS WELL SAVE YOUR TYPING. I THINK THINKSO13 IS A VERY ANGERY PERSON WHO FEELS THE NEED TO DEMEAN US FOR SOME REASON

 

329 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

no thanks.if he wants to fight.bring it on.he's got a bad attudute and so do i.

 

330 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

 

 

THERE IS EQUALITY IN OUR CHURCH WE JUST HAVE DIFFERENT PLACES LIKE THE FAMILY UNIT I AM NO LESS THAN MY HUSBAND BECAUSE I STAY HOME WITH OUR DAUGHTER. WHAT HAS YOUR RELIGIOUS LEADER DONE FOR OUR WORLD? THE POPE DID THINGS MANY PEOPLE COULD NOT DO BY THEMSELVES AND HE DID IT HIMSELF

 

THE THING PEOPLE DON'T LIKE ABOUT OUR FAITH IT IS IN THE BIBLE. JUST READ!!! YOU CAN CHANGE THE WORLD BUT YOU CAN'T CHANGE GOD NOT EVEN A MASTER DEBATER AS YOURSELF. NO ONE EXPECTS YOU TO CHANGE YOUR THOUGHTS JUST COMMUNICATE THEM BETTER

 

331 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

ACTUALLYTHE CHURCH DOES TELL YOU WHEN TO HAVE SEX....AFTER YOU ARE MARRIED.....YOU GET MARRIED AFTER YOU GO THROUGH CLASSES TO HELP YOU SEE IF ITS MR / MS RIGHT IS RIGHT FOR YOU. YOU CAN DO BOTH IT WORKED FOR ME. AND MY HUSBAND ISN'T EVEN CATHOLIC! MY YOUNGEST BOTHER IS YOUR AGE (I HAVE 2 SISTERS YOUNGER THAN THAT) I DON'T THINK HE IS EVEN CLOSE TO BEING SO SURE OF HIS BELIEFS. YOU ARE QUITE THE YOUNG ONE (NOW I SOUND SO OLD I AM 24)

 

332 Apr-6 From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

 

>I simply disagree that he was as great as all the press he is getting. To me as a protestant, he was just an overworked leader of a dying church who made a very large mistake in not handling the child abuse scandal before it did major damage to the credibility of the entire Catholic church.<

 

My view is that the screw ups were here in the U.S.. The bishops tried to cover up the clergy abuses. That was a big mistake, to say the least. That's where the buck should've stopped, here in the United States.

 

As far as Pope John Paul II, I give him high marks for helping to free Eastern Europe from Soviet Union rule, and also for helping to heal old wounds between the religions. I think that he accomplished a lot more than previous Popes, on the world stage.

 

Fred

 

.

[Jeb]

333 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: telstar17

 

also just before he died. he raised his hand and said "Bless you." then the hand went down and he died at that point.

 

334 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: sumatoronto

 

 

 

only way is to superglue their mouths shut(to match their brains)

 

superglue their fingers and thumbs together then the hands together

 

 

 

a reply to:

 

 

 

will somone please tell the bible thumpers to shut up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

335 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: hothingz4one

 

 

 

he aint catholic. so he cant be a Pope

 

 

 

a reply to:

 

 

 

I think bush should be the new pope,

 

336 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: dughr

 

 

 

now why are you insulting Jim?? i think that was a beautiful dream.

 

and the dream might have even been true. he was that generous in life

 

337 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

Thank you for the compliment of calling me a master debater. As a protestant my religeous leader is Jesus Christ. I will assume you know what He did for the world. My bible is the same as yours. I'm near 60 years old and prefer the King James Version. I believe along with other protestants that we need no huge church bureauacracy to be saved. That's probably the major difference between us. If you wish I can ask my younger brother to join this discussion. He is an ordained Protestant Minister with a PHD in religeon from Princeton University. Perhaps he will communicate in a manner more to your liking but I think his opinions will be much the same as mine.

 

338 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

i didn't now that.so how old is thinkso13 anyway.

 

339 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

dude you don't listen do you.look you have a bad attude so ask your brother i don't care as much as you do.

 

340 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: steph1892

 

 

 

Steph;

 

Thanks for the mister, I like that much better than "dude". You have the fire of youth, that is good. You are correct when you say only God knows where John Paul deserves to go. I won't put you down for being young and I think it's great that you have strong convictions. Do you talk to your grandfather the way you talk to me? I'm 58.

 

341 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: jonsmizzle11

 

 

 

you and all those who do that "born again" stuff is taking the whole thing out of context.

 

to tell all those who don't follow your version of religion that they are going to hell. due to them not following you and your version, is wrong.

 

it is up to that person to seek the wisdom and enlightenment their own way. and for them to seek their own answers

 

and catholics see the Pope as a intercessor.. just like some protestant sects see their ministers as. to help their prayers got to the proper "ear(s)"

 

342 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: thinkso13

 

thanks.sometimes i do but other times i just sit around.sorry.

 

343 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

WELL NOW I KNOW I AM TALKING TO SOME ONE BECAUSE AGE ALONE DESERVES RESPECT. AS I AM 24 THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IN OUR BIBLES IS THE OLD TESTEMENT, WE BELIEVE YOU CAN NOT HAVE ONE WITH OUT THE OTHER, MAKES GOOD SENSE TO ME. JESUS STATED OUR CHUCH HIMSELF BECAUSE ST PETER WAS OUR FIRST POPE. I AM NOT DISRESPECTING YOUR FAITH BUT ALL CHRISTIAN FAITHS ORIGINATED FROM US. I DON'T BELIEVE ANY FAITH IS LESS THAN ANY OTHER, IT IS WHERE EVER YOUR HEART FEELS ITS HOME. MINE IS IN MY CHURCH, I BELIEVE THAT MARY DESERVES HONOR (SO REALLY HOW CAN WE THINK LESS OF WOMEN IF WEARE THE FEW THAT DO HONOR THE GREATESYT WOMAN?) I DON'T LIKE IT BUT I SEE WHY WE DON'T ALLOW BIRTH CONTROL, (BECAUSE WE'D TRUST IN SCIENCE INSTEAD OF GOD.) I BELIEVE PRIESTS ( AND BELIEVE METHERE ARE GOOD ONES) SHOULD NOT MARRY BECAUSE THEY ARE MARRIED TO HIS PARISH. IF A MAN MARRIES HIS FAMILY IS HIS ONLY PRIORITY IF HE HAS BOTH IT IS ALMOST AS HE HAS 2 FAMILIES ONE MAY SUFFER IN THE END. SO YOU SEE THE POPE IS OUR LEADER BUT OUR FAITH IS SO MUCH MORE THEN JUST HIM, BUT IT IS STLL LIKE LOOSING OUR FAMILY MATRIARCH. WE MAY NOT HAVE EVER KNOWN HIM (MOST OF US NEVER REALLY KNOW OUR GREAT-GRANDPARENTS ) BUT IT DOESN'T MAKE THEMANY LESS IMPORTANT IN THE GRAND SCEAM OF OUR FAMILY.

 

344 Apr-6 From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

 

 

DIDN'T KNOW WHAT???

 

 

 

345 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

i believe in god but my friends say he does not exist.i said there wrong but they tell me he doesn't.then i start to think if he is real,that's perpresher.i am the only kid here but i still type

 

346 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

what didn't i now

 

347 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: steph1892

 

you are one very bitter person to even tear down someone who wants folks to remember the good things. may i suggest counseling?!?!

 

348 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: taliaNkheldar

 

no thanks i took counseling.didn't do much good.look i thought he was a teenager.

i am not bitter.i'm only 13.

 

349 Apr-6 From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

that they had sex talk.i don't plan to have sex until im 18.and that is perpresher.

please write back

 

350 Apr-6 From: taliaNkheldar To: leethev

 

 

 

havent you heard about the saying "do NOT speak ill of the dead"??

 

also about the curse of speaking ill of the dead. how your life will not be good from that point on

 

351 Apr-6 From: thinkso13 To: blushn80

 

 

 

We protestants also believe and study the old testament. The protestant faith started with Martin Luther who founded what is now known as the Lutheran Church. All the protestant denominations stem from there. I doubt if your church has taught you much about him or us. Most of the catholics I know have been taught that theirs is the only path to God. You might find it interesting to read some about him, if only to understand other faiths better. I'm sure there are many good priests. Protestants can never lose the leader of our faith because we acknowlege no leader other than Christ. We believe He leads us the same way he led St Peter and all the other disciples. We believe our prayers go to him direct without the aid of intercession of saints. We respect Mary as the mother of Christ, but we do not pray to anyone but Jesus or God Himself since they are one and the same since the resurection. Imagine me preaching to a Catholic!

 

352 12:00 AM From: steph1892 To: wildjen6

 

wow.that is the sweetest thing i have ever heard on here.i agree with you.he want peace in the world and he got his wish.write back

 

353 12:22 AM From: blushn80 To: taliaNkheldar

 

she is not bitter she is just upset that people are disrespectfulof the pope people are dealing with an outspoken 13yr old

 

354 12:35 AM From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

you stoud up for me.no one has ever stoud up for me like that before.thanks a whole lot.

any time you want to chat.steph1892@cs.com.

 

355 12:46 AM From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

peer pressure can be tuff but believe me you will be lucky if the names of people you are in school now. i don't want to go into a sex discussion too much because i don't know your parents thoughts. I will say that I didn't have sex until I was 19 I was very young when I got married I was a month away from being. 20. Just remember if a guy (I am assuming you are a girl) truely loves you he will wait until you are ready. If he wants to "proove" how much he loves you have him buy you a dimand ring LOL. Seriously though if your friends don't believe in GOD it's ok it may be something they need to find themselves. You maybe able to help thier search for GOD my friend said she didn't believe in GOD that she believed in reincarnation. So I asked her who or what decided what you come back as? You are clever you will find away to stump them. If your friends put your faith down they aren't your friends anyway. They should respect your thoughts & feelings if they are your friends they will unerstand

 

356 1:09 AM From: rar12868 To: brooklynbud69

 

 

 

<<John Paul's greatest achievement was taking the Catholic Church back to Vatican I. The reforms of Vatican II were completely obliterated. No, I will not mourn this man. He turned his head while thousands of priests were molesting young children and chastised thousands of followers because they did not meet with his neo-conservative views.

 

I pray that the new Pontiff will be more tolerant and take us forward, NOT back. The Catholic Church needs to move into the 21st Century. The challenges that lie ahead are many, but a progressive Pope can guide the Church with compassion and tolerance.<<

 

I agree, and I'm not a Catholic, but an Atheist.

 

357 1:15 AM From: rar12868 To: erh411706

 

 

 

>>Now another group of red hats can elect a different man to sit in the isolation of Vatican City and try to have everyone adhere to his utterances. None of them know what goes on in the real world.

 

I say abolish the whole beurocracy and give the money back to the poor from whom it was stolen in the first place.<<

 

Let's donate some of it to science, which may some day be able to save some of these people who will eventually end up with a now incurable disease. I heard the Pope prayed for and blessed the sick, but never heard of anyone being cured.

 

358 1:59 AM From: steph1892 To: blushn80

 

dont worry i wasn't ready to have a talk about sex.you were young when when you got married.

i still believe in god.your right maybe they arn't my friends.i have other friends who believe in god.i live with my grandparents.i was adopted when i was 6.i have to stay away from my mom because she is a drug head.im angry at her for lieing to me.my mom had 8 kid but 1 died at birth..i am a girl.i have a boyfriend.but we are not serious.am i the only teenager talking to all these people.thanks again for standing up for me.

 

359 2:01 AM From: arabiansanchez To: blushn80

 

 

 

Well thank you. All I'm saying is I think he was of an older generation who is not receptive of such things in society.

 

As for it being written in the bible I'm guessing that would be old testament which is pretty much over-ridden by Jesus's teachings in the new testemant, like many other things.

 

JP II was a brilliant Pope who achieved many fantastic things during his papacy but I do think that perhaps some of the social and moral issues of the day require a younger, more open-minded Pope. Then again perhaps I'm being ageist but that's my opinion.

 

360 2:06 AM From: steph1892 To: taliaNkheldar

 

bush cant be the new pope because he is president.my granny told me that.

 

361 2:07 AM From: arabiansanchez To: thinkso13

 

John Paul II accelerated the death of Communism in Europe and throughout many parts of the world. I'd call that bringing peace. As for him being an overworked leader of a dying church 1 in 6 people on this planet are Catholic and I would guess alot fo of them are worshippers and the vast majority atleast live their lives in a 'Christian' fashion.

 

362 8:38 AM From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

no problem.

 

363 9:00 AM From: blushn80 To: thinkso13

 

 

 

YES I DID RESEARCH OTHER FAITHS FAITHS BEFORE I MADE MY CONFORMATION TO THE CHURCH. I ACTUALLY ATTENDED ANGELICAN AND UNITARIAN CHURCHES DURING MY PERSONAL SEARCH. JUST SO THAT YOU ARE BETTER INFORMED WE ASK FOR MARY AND OTHER SAINTS TO PRAY FOR US AS WE ASK OUR FRIENDS HERE. IF YOU ARE REFFERING TO THE ROSARY AS PRAYING TO ONE OTHER THAN GOD. THE ROSARY IS ACTUALLY FROM THE BIBLE WHEN THE ANGEL CAME TO HER WITH GODS REQUEST OF HER AND WHEN HER COUSIN CAME TO VISIT HER. WE JUST RECITE THESE VERSES. WE BELIEVE THAT SHE IS BEST TO HELP BECAUSE WHO HAS MORE "PULL" THAN ONES MOTHER. MARY WILL LEAD ANYONE TO HER SON WHO ASKS HER TO. THIS IS HOW I FOUND HIM.

 

AS FAR AS THOSE CATHOLICS WHO DISRESPECT OTHER FAITHS IT IS TO MY KNOWLAGE MOST ARE HYPOCRITICAL IN SOME OF THEIR THINKING. I BELIEVE THE WAY MOTHER TEREASA TAUGHT ...LEAD BY EXAMPLE THOSE WHO LOOK DOWN OR DO NOT UNDERSTAND US....SHOW THEM THROUGH OUR ACTIONS (ON THIS BELIEF SHE CONVERTED MANY)

 

364 9:20 AM From: blushn80 To: rar12868

 

 

 

EXCUSE ME THEIR SOULS WERE HEALED...GIVE THE MONEY TO SCIENCE? GIVE IT TO THE ONES THAT FOUND AWAY TO KILL THE INNOCENT. ..THE ONES THAT PAY FOR "FEATUSES". SO THAT PEOPLE WHO PUT THEIR NEED TO WALK ABOVE THE SLAUGHTER OF AN INNOCENT LIFE? NOT ALL SCIENE IS BAD BUT I KNOW WHERE MY MONEY GOES WHEN I PUT IT IN THE CURCH PLATE.

 

I HAVE SEEN OUR BUDGET, WHAT IS COSTS US TO MAITAIN OUR CHURCH. OUR PRIEST IS NOT RICH HE DRIVES AN EARLY 90S CHEVY. OUR CHURCH HELPS PEOPLE WITH OUR FOOD PANTRY AND NOT JUST THOSE WHO ARE CATHOLIC. WE HEP ALL THAT WE CAN. SO DON'T TELL ME MY CHURCH DOES NO GOOD!! NONE OF MY MONET LEAVES MY CHURCHES AREA AND THE SAME GOES FOR THE OTHER CHURCHES I EVER BEEN TO. VATICAN HAS MUCH BECAUSE OF VISITORS AND THEIR OUR PARISH. SO YOU SHOULD INFORM YOURSELF BEFORE DEGRADING WHAT YOU DO NOT KNOW

 

365 9:24 AM From: blushn80 To: steph1892

 

I WILL E MAIL YOU I AM IN A SIMALER PLACE WITH MY PARENTS BUT I WILL PUT IT IN EMAIL SO THESE PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO READ US GO ON ABOUT OUSELVES PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU GET IT THOUGH

 

366 9:35 AM From: blushn80 To: arabiansanchez

 

WE BELIEVE THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENTS GO TOGETHER ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER IS LIKE HAVING ONLY HALF THE STORY. LIKE I HAVE SAID TIMES CHANGE GOD DOES NOT. I THINK THAT THE TIME RIGHT NOW GOD IS TESTING US MORE THAN EVER AND IN MANY WAYS WE ARE FAILING. I NEVER HEARD THE POPECONDEM GAY PEOPLE TO HELL, JUST STATED WHATOUR FAITH HAS ALWAYS TAUGHT. REMEMBER YOU ARE LOVED REGARDLESS OF YOUR DIFFERENCE OF OPINION OR BELIEF.

 

367 9:37 AM From: rar12868 To: blushn80

 

 

 

>>EXCUSE ME THEIR SOULS WERE HEALED...<<

 

What is that? What is a soul, exactly? How was it injured or ill?

 

>>GIVE THE MONEY TO SCIENCE? GIVE IT TO THE ONES THAT FOUND AWAY TO KILL THE INNOCENT. ..THE ONES THAT PAY FOR "FEATUSES". SO THAT PEOPLE WHO PUT THEIR NEED TO WALK ABOVE THE SLAUGHTER OF AN INNOCENT LIFE? NOT ALL SCIENE IS BAD BUT I KNOW WHERE MY MONEY GOES WHEN I PUT IT IN THE CURCH PLATE.<<

 

Could it possibly be going to the million dollar settlements, necessary due to sexual abuse against children by priests for years and years? So in other words, you want them alive (featuses), in order that they may become the sexual outlet for pedophelia priests? And speaking of featuses...why no birth control? I guess it's much more ethical to keep having them even if you can't take care of them, and then rely on the church's food pantry? Isn't that just another way the church becomes a crutch for people?

 

>>I HAVE SEEN OUR BUDGET, WHAT IS COSTS US TO MAITAIN OUR CHURCH. OUR PRIEST IS NOT RICH HE DRIVES AN EARLY 90S CHEVY. OUR CHURCH HELPS PEOPLE WITH OUR FOOD PANTRY AND NOT JUST THOSE WHO ARE CATHOLIC. WE HEP ALL THAT WE CAN. SO DON'T TELL ME MY CHURCH DOES NO GOOD!! NONE OF MY MONET LEAVES MY CHURCHES AREA AND THE SAME GOES FOR THE OTHER CHURCHES I EVER BEEN TO. VATICAN HAS MUCH BECAUSE OF VISITORS AND THEIR OUR PARISH. SO YOU SHOULD INFORM YOURSELF BEFORE DEGRADING WHAT YOU DO NOT KNOW<<

 

Oh please! Hundreds, if not thousands of organizations NOT related to religion help millions of people around the world. And they do it with no motivation of, "Get to heaven through good works".

 

368 9:59 AM From: blushn80 To: rar12868

 

 

 

NO THE MONEY DOES NOT GO TO LAWSUITS IT STAYS IN OUR CHURCH. LIKE I SAID I HAVE SEEN THE BOOKS (MY MOM IS THE BOOK KEEPER.) WHY DO YOU LIKE STEREOTYPES? NOT ALL PRIESTS ARE MOLESTERS THERE ARE MANY GOOD PRIESTS. AS FOR THE BAD ONES SOME OF US ARE TRYING TO WEED THEM OUT. (UNLIKE THE PEOPLE WHO JUST TALK ABOUT IT.)

 

AS FAR AS BIRTH CONTROL A WOMAN WHO TAKES IT IS NOT PUTTING HER TRUST IN GOD BUT A PILL ECT.

 

AS FAR AS TOO MANY BABIES IV'VE BEEN MARRIED 5 YEARS I ONLY HAVE ONE CHILD. GOD DOESN'T GIVE US MORE THAN WE CAN HANDLE. BESIDES AREN'T CHILDREN WORTH MORE THAN ANY AMOUNT OF MONEY? SO WHY DENY ONE? I DO'N'T KNOW OF ANY ONE WHO WOULD REJECT A MILLION DOLLARS EVEN IF THEY ALREADY HAD A MILLION. I AM THE OLDEST OF 6 AND WE ARE THE AGES FROM 24 TO 8. THERE IS NOT ONE OF MY SIBBLINGS I COULD PICTURE LIVING WITHOUT. WE ARE CLOSER THAN MANY FAMILIES I HAVE SEEN.

 

ALOT OF THE FAMILIES WE HELP ARE PEOPLE FROM AFRICA OR VIETNAM. PEOPLE WHO CAME TO THE US FOR A BETTER LIFE, WHO TUELY NEED HELP.

 

WHEN A WOMAN CAN GET PREGNANT JUST TO SELL THE LIFE THAT DEPENDS ON HER TO SCIENCE....JUST SO YOU KNOW STEMCELLS COULD HELP ME, BUT IF IT IS AT THE COST OF AN INNOCENT LIFE IT'S NOT WORTH IT. USING AFTER BIRTH IS FAR MORE FITTING A NEW LIFE BETTERING ANOTHER THAT IDEA I LOVE.

 

LAST AS FAR A OTHERS GIVING MONEY, YOU KNOW THE ONES WHO HAVE A MUCH BIGGER BUGET OF OUR 3,000.....IT COULDN'T BE THE TAX RIDE OFF COULD IT? AT LEAST OUR INTENTIONS ARE GOOD

 

369 10:06 AM From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

Most of the catholics I know have been taught that theirs is the only path to God. <<<<<

 

That changed 40 years ago with Pope John. All faiths can enter the Kingdom of Heaven, from the Catholic view.

What you're probably thinking of are the Baptists and Born Again Christians, who believe that only through Jesus can you be saved.

 

Fred

 

.

 

 

 

370 11:02 AM From: arabiansanchez To: blushn80

 

I believe his words were that everyone should pray for people embarking upon the evil, unnatural act of homosexuality. If the Pope keeps such a view then half the world are given permission through him to continue a drive for inequality. I know many people are against homosexuality in the Catholic faith but many are also open-minded and accepting and alot of JPII's views didn't reflect a general opinion among his followers.

 

371 11:33 AM From: rar12868 To: blushn80

 

 

 

>>NO THE MONEY DOES NOT GO TO LAWSUITS IT STAYS IN OUR CHURCH. LIKE I SAID I HAVE SEEN THE BOOKS (MY MOM IS THE BOOK KEEPER.) WHY DO YOU LIKE STEREOTYPES? NOT ALL PRIESTS ARE MOLESTERS THERE ARE MANY GOOD PRIESTS. AS FOR THE BAD ONES SOME OF US ARE TRYING TO WEED THEM OUT. (UNLIKE THE PEOPLE WHO JUST TALK ABOUT IT.)<<

 

Oh, I don't like stereotypes. I would just prefer you would take this same attitude with science, and not claim it to be a "featus killer", as you did.

 

>>AS FAR AS BIRTH CONTROL A WOMAN WHO TAKES IT IS NOT PUTTING HER TRUST IN GOD BUT A PILL ECT.<<

 

So just keep cranking them out? If god says 20 kids for you, and your already struggling to make it, just keep them coming anyway?

 

>>AS FAR AS TOO MANY BABIES IV'VE BEEN MARRIED 5 YEARS I ONLY HAVE ONE CHILD. GOD DOESN'T GIVE US MORE THAN WE CAN HANDLE. BESIDES AREN'T CHILDREN WORTH MORE THAN ANY AMOUNT OF MONEY? SO WHY DENY ONE?<<

I would venture to say, your experience (1 in 5yrs) is atypical. Most fertile women would most likely have had atleast 3 in 5yrs if left to reproduce without any intervention. Irregardless, your statement of, "God doesn't give us more than we can handle", is the ultimate passive posture. You take NO responsibility for your own life, and pass it on to your god. It appears to me to be one of the most extreme ways to remain a child for life and avoid adult reponsibilities.

 

>>THERE IS NOT ONE OF MY SIBBLINGS I COULD PICTURE LIVING WITHOUT.<<

 

Well, obviously. Their a part of your life, so your frame of reference comes from that. Your current reality does not include being the sister of one brother, or a sister and brother, or an only child. It's no different than asking you to describe life as an 80yr old man. You can't possibly give any meaning to it, except with a general description of what you've observed, not experienced personally.

 

>>ALOT OF THE FAMILIES WE HELP ARE PEOPLE FROM AFRICA OR VIETNAM. PEOPLE WHO CAME TO THE US FOR A BETTER LIFE, WHO TUELY NEED HELP.<<

 

That's wonderful. Nothing wrong with that. But the Catholic church specifically preaches "to heaven through good works". Why not reach out to people for no other reason than to help, and expect nothing in return? And then there's the result that sometimes the helped want to be like the helper. And thus, you have new members of a church. It's just plain recruitment.

 

>>WHEN A WOMAN CAN GET PREGNANT JUST TO SELL THE LIFE THAT DEPENDS ON HER TO SCIENCE....<<

 

I don't think you completed your thought here.

 

>>JUST SO YOU KNOW STEMCELLS COULD HELP ME, BUT IF IT IS AT THE COST OF AN INNOCENT LIFE IT'S NOT WORTH IT. USING AFTER BIRTH IS FAR MORE FITTING A NEW LIFE BETTERING ANOTHER THAT IDEA I LOVE.<<

 

What you call an innocent life, is a small (less than 100) cluster of cells, so early in the cell multiplication process, that they haven't even been "assigned" a specific job yet (eyes, ears, heart muscle, thigh bone, etc). Because of this, they could be assigned as any organ, muscle, skin, bone, etc in the body.

 

>>LAST AS FAR A OTHERS GIVING MONEY, YOU KNOW THE ONES WHO HAVE A MUCH BIGGER BUGET OF OUR 3,000.....IT COULDN'T BE THE TAX RIDE OFF COULD IT? AT LEAST OUR INTENTIONS ARE GOOD<<

 

No different than the church, which pays NO taxes, ever. And your intentions may be good superficially, but again, specific to the Catholic Church, good works are stressed as the way to heaven.

 

372 1:45 PM From: blushn80 To: rar12868

 

 

 

YES I BELIEVE THAT THESE "CELLS" ARE A BABY FROM CONCEPTION I HAVE CP, SO YES THIS RESEARCH COULD HELPME BUT AS I SAID..NOT WORTH IT. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN REAL SCIENCE & PLAYING GOD.

 

NATURAL FAMILY METHOD WORKS AND I AM NOT SURE THAT CONDOMS ARE OUT OF THE QUESTION. MY PRIEST HAS NEVER TOLD ME OTHER WISE, THOUGH IT MAYBE DUE TO MY DISABILITY (I NEARLY DIED BEFORE). WE DON'T BELIEVE IN THE RX STUFF BECAUSE THEY ARE BASICLY A CHEMICAL ABORTION. (WOULDN'T IT MAKE OUR TEACHINGS OF ABOTION HYPOCRITICAL )

 

I REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT JUST BY FAITH ALONE THAT YOU CAN BE "SAVED" SOME ONE WHO IS "SAVED" CAN KILL SOMEONE ELSE, BUT BECAUSE HE IS "SAVED HE DOESN'T HAVE TO ATONE FOR IT OR ANY OTHER SIN HE HAS COMMITED. I JUST CAN'T SEE IT. IMAGINE IF NO ONE DID WORKS? BECAUSE BELIEVE IT OR NOT WE DON'T HAVE AN AGENDA WE VOLENTEER OUR TIME BECAUSE WE WANT TO BESIDES WE ARE TO WALK CHRISTS PATH. HE DID NOT JUST PREACH. HE HIMSELF DID "WORKS". I DID NOT HAVE A STEREOTYPE I SAID NOT ALL SCIENCE IS BAD. YOU HOWEVER HAVE USED NEARLY ALL OF CATHOLICS. BECAUSE YOU KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT US. I DON'T BELIEVE IN PUTTING ANY OTHER FAITHS DOWN, ESPEACALLY IF I KNOW LITTLE ABOUT IT. I THINK AS LONG AS THERE ARE GOOD PEOPLE IN THESE FAITHS ONLY GOOD CAN COME OF THEM

 

373 1:25 PM From: Aeradan70 To: Dayhawk Kim

 

 

 

Italian, scientist (an astrophysicist, indeed), catholic believer, here!

 

Not easy to cope with both faces of me (cartesian mind and spiritual soul), but some things John Paul II did, made everything very smooth!

 

Apologizing for Church sins is one of these, and it was meant for wrongdoing and omissions against Jews (our elder brothers) or scientists (Galileo Galilei, for instance).

 

But has anything of this to do with the Church? Yes! And No.

 

Yes: the Pope is, for us Catholics, the Christ Vicary on the Earth. This means not he's like Christ, he's only his deputy. Still, he represents our Church. Is that because of Peter? Yes. Some of you already wrote how the tale goes; Christ told Peter: "You're Peter, and on this Stone I will found my Church."

 

This is how I was learned, and it has a deep meaning as in Aramaic Peter (Cefa) means "stone". I seem to acknowledge some differences in the translation you mention.

 

Now, being the Pope, leader of 1200 million people throughout the world, being from oppressed Poland, I would have told myself "What's the hell? I am the moral authority to define what's right or wrong for 20% the world population. Let me find the words and I'll lead and win a third world war against communism."

 

But no, thanks God, this is something we didn't see. "How many armies has the Vatican?" the USSR leader asked during the Cuba missile crisis. None, but that means nothing.

 

It is not with armies that Gandhi freed India from UK, and Madre Teresa fed poor people in Calcutta. These are but examples of things that you cannot win by brutal force.

 

When the Pope apologized for Church mistakes, he did it in the name of all of us, and he was sincere, otherwise he could have shown one face in front of the Jews (the apologizing one) and another in front of the Communism (the bullying one.

 

You didn't see this. You saw a person talking, addressing people, wandering, meeting with people, and a praying person.

 

And every time he was talking, addressing people from his conscience, meeting them to stop violence and spread peace, praying with them, he did it as our (Catholic) representative.

 

In this, I have to say, dear Jenn131...dunnowhat, I was deeply hurt by the way you addressed people having opinions different from your one. If you really respected this Pope, you should have never ever thought to reply in such a harsh manner to anybody, whatever they said. What did you learned of the Pope forgiving Ali Agca?

 

And now there comes the No part: why what Pope did has nothing to do with the Church.

 

First of all I want to make one thing clear: Vatican is an indipendent Nation; the Catholic Church is a Religion; Faith in God is a Gift of the Almighty. You cannot mix the three things together, otherwise we go to nowhere. For instance: I can be a citizen of the Vatican and not be a Catholic (I believe some of the Swiss Guards relatives are) or even a believer; or I can be a Catholic and not living in the Vatican (the laws of the Vatican don't apply to me).

 

In the same way, if I believe and, for choice or education, I am a Catholic, this doesn't make the sins of my priest fall on me, nor it makes the good things my Pope did affect my sin-stack. The thing I have in common with these persons is the way I choose (or were educated) to celebrate my spiritual devotion and link with the Almighy.

 

To be more clear, I don't condemn American citizens because their industries want to sell GMO grain to third-world countries to make tests on their skin and save their wallets, and don't want to give AIDS drugs at a reasonable price, or because their President always boasts about civil liberties in other countries while US were left alone with Somalia to execute people under 18... One thing is the individual, another is his representative (until you cannot elect him).

 

So, my NO means that in everyhing there's measure: I have to take great care when I say what's right and what's wrong (if I want to, as it means judging...)

 

Now, most of you seem to see the Church as an organization, and it is not: as I said, it is a Religion. Yes, it is organized in some way or the other, but it is still a Religion.

 

And is it rich? Well, you see on TV people going here and there with black cars, fat belly and all, and you believe "Yes, ALL the Church is a rich organization!". I mean, you could criticize the Church as much as you want, but none of you will criticize it as the citizens of Rome do. But at least, they know what they are talking about!

 

I would like you to go to Assisi, where there are the poor San Francesco monks: that's the Church too! And would like you to see the Missionairs in Africa fighting against plagues, AIDS (...), wars, ignorance... there it goes and is spent the money!

 

But I know you are from the first world, where everybody is rich, healthy, well educated (...), young or with a lifting, married a few times and don't want to give a look at these things... too bad, too bad.

 

Finally, let's come to the conservative thing, that really makes me crazy, because there should be no intelligent person arguing on this.

 

John Paul II was the first Pope ever to publicly give science a role in culture, and it happened even in the very beginning of its papacy. He didn't hide after a pointing finger addressing the science "thing" as if it were the big menace to the Church (as it is not). He asked all the people coming from all the branches of politics, finance, culture, art, and science to work together for the mutual interest.

 

Fine, so that's about science, but what about the rest? What about homosexuals, what about women and clergy, what about marriage for priests, what about abortion?

 

This is so poor. Catholic Church is, I repeat it again, a Religion, it is not the Faith in God. As a religion, it is but run by imperfect men that are given some teachings both moral and spiritual. Their aim in life is not earning money, it is saving souls according to the moral and spiritual teachings they were given.

 

Church is not an organization like a political party. It's not a democracy where you can discuss if next candidate to presidency must address problems like the gun-selling lobby or the marriage to homosexuals. It is a league of persons united by a common belief in God AND his teachings.

 

You want the Church to start accepting abortion? On what moral basis? THOU SHALL NOT MURDER it is written. It is not written under which condition it is allowed to murder: this is not one of our, poor, deficient, earthly laws, where a good lawyer is able to make the guilty seem innocent and the innocent seem guilty.

 

But, on the other side, I have to say that only a few times in my life I heard (HEARD) of a priest unable to understand the sorrow of a mother crying after having lost her baby. Because things like this happen, this is life, and it is to prevent such sorrows to happen that the teachings of the Church are given. But no priest will not forgive a sinner repenting of his deeds.

 

You want the Church to accept priestesses? Let's start saying that this Pope exalted the feminine in the Church like no other, as he was

...[Message truncated]

 

374 2:15 PM From: rar12868 To: blushn80

 

 

 

>>YES I BELIEVE THAT THESE "CELLS" ARE A BABY FROM CONCEPTION I HAVE CP, SO YES THIS RESEARCH COULD HELPME BUT AS I SAID..NOT WORTH IT. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN REAL SCIENCE & PLAYING GOD.<<

 

What if that meant dying and leaving your children motherless?

 

NATURAL FAMILY METHOD WORKS AND I AM NOT SURE THAT CONDOMS ARE OUT OF THE QUESTION. MY PRIEST HAS NEVER TOLD ME OTHER WISE, THOUGH IT MAYBE DUE TO MY DISABILITY (I NEARLY DIED BEFORE). WE DON'T BELIEVE IN THE RX STUFF BECAUSE THEY ARE BASICLY A CHEMICAL ABORTION. (WOULDN'T IT MAKE OUR TEACHINGS OF ABOTION HYPOCRITICAL )

 

The Pope has spoke on condoms before, and yes, they are also a no-no. As far as what you call the "Rx stuff", what abortion??? It PREVENTS conception, it doesn't terminate a conception. And then there's sterilization? I sappose that too, is out of the question.

 

>>I REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT JUST BY FAITH ALONE THAT YOU CAN BE "SAVED" SOME ONE WHO IS "SAVED" CAN KILL SOMEONE ELSE, BUT BECAUSE HE IS "SAVED HE DOESN'T HAVE TO ATONE FOR IT OR ANY OTHER SIN HE HAS COMMITED. I JUST CAN'T SEE IT. IMAGINE IF NO ONE DID WORKS? BECAUSE BELIEVE IT OR NOT WE DON'T HAVE AN AGENDA WE VOLENTEER OUR TIME BECAUSE WE WANT TO BESIDES WE ARE TO WALK CHRISTS PATH. HE DID NOT JUST PREACH. HE HIMSELF DID "WORKS".<<

 

Right, well the Methodists call what you do "working or buying your way into heaven". So be it. It's all a sham as far as I'm concerned.

 

>>I DID NOT HAVE A STEREOTYPE I SAID NOT ALL SCIENCE IS BAD. YOU HOWEVER HAVE USED NEARLY ALL OF CATHOLICS. BECAUSE YOU KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT US. I DON'T BELIEVE IN PUTTING ANY OTHER FAITHS DOWN, ESPEACALLY IF I KNOW LITTLE ABOUT IT. I THINK AS LONG AS THERE ARE GOOD PEOPLE IN THESE FAITHS ONLY GOOD CAN COME OF THEM<<

 

Oh, don't get me wrong, I know lots of "good" religious people. But I don't discriminate when it comes to religions...they ALL need to go. From A to Z, from big to little, from left to right and up to down. They're a crutch, their built on people's fears, their mysogonistic, their repressive and controlling, most, if not all, are based on bits and pieces of past religions, they impede progress, their a money making scam, they promise something no one can proove they deliver, most have barbaric traditions and are based on uncivilized, irrational and exclusionary ideas and they frequently depict a savage god. But most believers are much too fearful of questioning their beliefs and unwilling to research what they base their whole lives on and prefer to take someone elses' word for it.

 

375 3:08 PM From: sbolert To: rar12868

 

 

 

>But most believers are much too fearful of questioning their beliefs and unwilling to research what they base their whole lives on and prefer to take someone elses' word for it.<

 

They are satisfied with their own belief, therefore, they have no reason to question it. It's not a matter of fear. They love their belief in God.

 

Sam

 

 

 

.

 

376 3:12 PM From: blushn80 To: rar12868

 

 

 

YES I WOULD SAY NO TO THE RESEARCH EVEN IF IT MEANT DYING. NO ONE LIFE WORTH ANOTHER, ESPEICALLY IF IT IS JUST THE"QUALITY" OF IT. MY OB'S DIRECTIONS DURING MY LABOR WERE THAT MY CHILDS LIFE CAME FIRST REGARDLESS.

 

YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ON BC... THE PILL MAKES NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE FOR THE FERTLIZED EGG GROW., THEREFORE CAUSING AVEY EARLY ABORTION. ....THE DEPO SHOT ALLOWS FERTLIZATION NEARLY 60% HOWEVER IT DOESN'T ALLOW THE IMPLANTED EGG TO CONNECT TO THE WALL, BASICLY IT IS STARVED OF NUTRIENTS IT NEEDS. CAUSING ABORTION.

 

FAITH IS WHAT KEEPS SOME PEOPLE GOOD. IF THERE IS NO FEAR OF GODS ANGER WHAT IS TO KEEP PEOPLE FROM RUNNING A MUCK? GETTING RID OF RELIGION IS LIKE SAYING GET RID OF ALL LAW. SOME PEOPLE FEAR INPRISIONMENT OTHERS FEAR GOD. EITHER WAY IT WORKS. NOT EVERYTHING ABOUT RELIGION IS ABOUT FEAR OR WHAT EVER NEGETIVITY YOU CHOOSE TO SEE. THERE IS UNITY WITH PEOPLE THAT SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS AND BELIEFS. I THINK THAT YOU LOOK DOWN ON US BECAUSE WE BELIEVE WITHOUT "PROOF" AND FOR SOME REASON YOU SEE WRONG IN THAT OR SEE US AS IGNORANT. I BELIEVE THAT I HAVE RECIEVED MY PROOF. ESPECIALLY COMING FROM WHAT I HAVE BEEN THROUGH IN MY LIFE. IF ALL OF US ARE WRONG SO WHAT FOR SOME IOUR BELIEFS ARE ALL WE HAVE. A LOT OF GOOD HAS COME OUT OF FAITH. SO WHAT IS THE HARM AS LONG AS WE DON'T FORCE IT ON YOU? I DON'T THINK I AM FORCING MY BELIEFS ON YOU. IF I AM, I AM SORRY I AM JUST TRYING TO GIVE MY VIEW.

 

377 3:42 PM From: thinkso13 To: bednarfp

 

Actually, Fred, I was speaking of Catholics I know who were educated in church schools over 40 years ago. (folks my age) Some of them refuse to attend any mass not conducted in Latin to this day. I suppose you could call them traditionalists. I do understand and agree with your point. I have no use for or trust in those who claim to posess the ONLY path to salvation. I mistrust extremists of any faith for there is where I find fanatics. Sometimes I wonder if God just sits and laughs at the foolish things men do in the name of religeon to separate themselves from thier brothers.

 

378 3:53 PM From: Anne To: kramerdjr

 

 

 

Hi David,

 

Realizing how he apologized to the Jews (about a thousand years too late), I know you are right about his compassion.

 

But, don't you think that most high level (and low level) clergy MUST have known for years and years about the many pedophile priests among them? It was all overlooked and covered up for decades! He protected Cardinal Law in the worst way. Are you aware of that fact? Does not that seem a bit over the top?

 

Compassion for the women in Africa whose AIDS infected husbands were NOT expected to wear condoms? That condoms, which save lives, were sinful?

 

379 4:32 PM From: bednarfp To: thinkso13

 

 

 

<Actually, Fred, I was speaking of Catholics I know who were educated in church schools over 40 years ago. (folks my age) Some of them refuse to attend any mass not conducted in Latin to this day. I suppose you could call them traditionalists. I do understand and agree with your point. I have no use for or trust in those who claim to posess the ONLY path to salvation. I mistrust extremists of any faith for there is where I find fanatics. Sometimes I wonder if God just sits and laughs at the foolish things men do in the name of religeon to separate themselves from thier brothers.<<<

 

I'm the same way, I really dislike extremists. They sure do give religion a bad name. Is any wonder why faith is fading in Europe and in the United States?

 

Fred

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

380 4:44 PM From: rar12868 To: blushn80

 

 

 

>>YES I WOULD SAY NO TO THE RESEARCH EVEN IF IT MEANT DYING. NO ONE LIFE WORTH ANOTHER, ESPEICALLY IF IT IS JUST THE"QUALITY" OF IT. MY OB'S DIRECTIONS DURING MY LABOR WERE THAT MY CHILDS LIFE CAME FIRST REGARDLESS.<<

 

Ok. well your choice.

 

>>YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ON BC... THE PILL MAKES NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE FOR THE FERTLIZED EGG GROW., THEREFORE CAUSING AVEY EARLY ABORTION. ....THE DEPO SHOT ALLOWS FERTLIZATION NEARLY 60% HOWEVER IT DOESN'T ALLOW THE IMPLANTED EGG TO CONNECT TO THE WALL, BASICLY IT IS STARVED OF NUTRIENTS IT NEEDS. CAUSING ABORTION.<<

 

I admit I don't know too much about the Depo shot, but your wrong about the pill. It prevents ovulation altogether.Therefore, no fertilization. There's also barrier methods to consider, that also prevent fertilization. I think by you saying, "No, no, no", you are actually closing off options for the best possible life for your current and future children. There's all sorts of "what if's" we could play through as far as pregnancy goes, but you seem content on sticking with, "No, no matter what".

 

>>FAITH IS WHAT KEEPS SOME PEOPLE GOOD. IF THERE IS NO FEAR OF GODS ANGER WHAT IS TO KEEP PEOPLE FROM RUNNING A MUCK?<<

 

You just said it yourself. Fear is what motivates people.I do not believe in any god, and my life is far from "a muck". I pay my taxes, have a graduate education, have a job, have an 18 yr marriage, have children that do well in school and have never been in trouble, I'm a veteran and I have never even gotten a traffic ticket. I volunteer atleast 15hrs a month as a court arbitrator for juvenile offenders. Need more? My point is no one needs religion to do the right thing or live a life that is beneficial to society. I've done fine without it. And the ising on the cake is, I have NO fear of any gods anger.

 

>>GETTING RID OF RELIGION IS LIKE SAYING GET RID OF ALL LAW. SOME PEOPLE FEAR INPRISIONMENT OTHERS FEAR GOD. EITHER WAY IT WORKS.<<

 

Law does not require the belief in an unprovable deity. Law has a history that's good and just, and works to improve all the time to benefit all of society. It is all inclusive, created by man, and therefore holds no guessing as to what it means. Not all laws are beneficial, but they are open for debate by everyone. Not to mention, I can bad mouth a law, and not be "punished" for it. And the law does not promise some pie in the sky, as you would promise a child some ice cream if they behave.

 

>>NOT EVERYTHING ABOUT RELIGION IS ABOUT FEAR OR WHAT EVER NEGETIVITY YOU CHOOSE TO SEE. THERE IS UNITY WITH PEOPLE THAT SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS AND BELIEFS. I THINK THAT YOU LOOK DOWN ON US BECAUSE WE BELIEVE WITHOUT "PROOF" AND FOR SOME REASON YOU SEE WRONG IN THAT OR SEE US AS IGNORANT. I BELIEVE THAT I HAVE RECIEVED MY PROOF. ESPECIALLY COMING FROM WHAT I HAVE BEEN THROUGH IN MY LIFE. IF ALL OF US ARE WRONG SO WHAT FOR SOME IOUR BELIEFS ARE ALL WE HAVE. A LOT OF GOOD HAS COME OUT OF FAITH. SO WHAT IS THE HARM AS LONG AS WE DON'T FORCE IT ON YOU? I DON'T THINK I AM FORCING MY BELIEFS ON YOU. IF I AM, I AM SORRY I AM JUST TRYING TO GIVE MY VIEW.<<

 

I do agree that there are some superficial good things about religion, like the relationships that are built in the church, and some of the moral guidelines. But IMO, the negative far outweighs the positive. In such a grand and global way, it knocks the legs out from under progress, and we all pay for that. I don't feel in anyway you are forcing your religion on me. But many, many people try to in subtle, and not so subtle ways. I would, at the very least, like for everyone to respect the seperation of church and state. Let's start in the public schools our taxes pay for...no prayer, return the pledge to it's original expression with no "under god" and teach evolution. I'm sure you would not appreciate your child being forced to hear about the tenants of let's say, Mohammad, Allah and Islam.

 

381 5:38 PM From: blushn80 To: rar12868

 

 

 

there is seporation of church and state. i don't know where you are from, but here in missouri we have completely the pledge out of our schools (since i was in 4th grade) why stop here take it off our money, i don't care. until i am not allowed to openly practice my faith as in nazi times

 

you must remember what thiscountry was founded for. freedom of religon. even islam believes in a higher power. you happen to be the minority here. it is rare that somone who has no faith does well. i know many who do not care one way or another most go to jail at least once.

 

i don't trust mans law...remember they once oked slavery. it is failing my 3 youngest sibling. we have been fighting dfs for 5 years trying to get Parental rights terminated but because the state gets $$$$ for reuniting families. at least 3 children just in my county have died due to these laws one made national news. laws fail contantly. my faith has never failed me and as i said i have my proof.

 

 

 

 

 

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WOW folks, so many messages, I will try and get them ALL here on my board.....

-Jeb, admin of ScienceWeather bb. April 7 2005 551pm DST

[Jeb]

Check out ALL the topics!!!

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